Royal No Longer Allowing Unvaccinated Guests 12 and up for cruises that go to St. Thomas?

[Cannon G]

We are sailing on Allure of the Seas on 8/8 and just received word that all guests 12 and up must be fully vaccinated. This is due to the USVI not allowing any ships to dock with unvaccinated 12 years old and up.
 

This is a major change if the email is correct.

[smokeybandit]

The change isn't that surprising. The timing sure is.

[Matt]

It's legit: https://www.royalcaribbeanblog.com/2021/08/02/us-virgin-islands-requires-all-cruise-ship-passengers-12-and-older-be-fully-vaccinated

[Cannon G]

11 minutes ago, Matt said:

It's legit: https://www.royalcaribbeanblog.com/2021/08/02/us-virgin-islands-requires-all-cruise-ship-passengers-12-and-older-be-fully-vaccinated

How do you think this last minute change will impact the mask requirements and venue blocks that were proposed for the ship? Do you think that it will now operate like Royal cruises sailing from outside of Florida? 

[cruisinghawg]

Looks like a way around the FL law.

[danv3]

I hope more ports will impose such vaccination requirements since the lines (and Florida) are unwilling. 

[Marlena]

Will this make them stop going to that port? Or changing to vaccines being mandatory due to it?

[Ampurp85]

Well I can see this being the case as they don't have access to vaccines like the US and want to keep their ports safe. I think it is going to come down to if you can be vaxxed, then you must be to sail on cruises that stop at ports.

[DanielB]

I have a November cruise to San Juan, I know it is a US Territory and not part of the US Virgin Islands but wonder if they will impose anything.  Are there any cruises to San Juan anytime soon?

[Marlena]

I wouldn't hate if more ports did the same and it was around around the Florida law...

[Aulayan]

I'm no lawyer but I don't see how this is around Florida Law.  Florida Law states that cruise lines can't ask for vaccine status.  St. Thomas states you can't come here if anyone over 12 is not vaccinated.

While I see Royal Caribbean trying to use this as a way around Florida Law, some Floridian (or their governor) is going to end up suing Royal Caribbean over this and I don't think this shields them at all. Legally it sounds more like if you sail from Florida, to follow both laws you would not be able to include the US Virgin Islands as a destination for the time being.

[Falling_Down]

Hopefully this wasn't addressed anywhere else (if it was I apologize) but am I reading correctly that all USVI ports now require all passengers aboard a cruise to be vaccinated or the ship cannot dock? Also, from what I understand RC is not canceling those ports just making a vaccine mandatory for anyone boarding whos itinerary includes a stop in USVI. Is that correct?  

[smokeybandit]

Just those 12+

[Falling_Down]

Thanks smokey! I feel like a doof I actually just found a thread about this same thing in the general discussion forum. Where is the facepalm emoji when I need it 

[cruisellama]

That's going to churn a whole lot of itineraries.  Plan to replan, repeat.

[steverk]

Interested in my November sailing.  It leaves san juan,  hits st. Croix and st. Thomas.  And st. Kitts. I appreciate Matt publishing the whole story,  but rather disturbing  

[karl_nj]

1 hour ago, Aulayan said:

I'm no lawyer but I don't see how this is around Florida Law.  Florida Law states that cruise lines can't ask for vaccine status.  St. Thomas states you can't come here if anyone over 12 is not vaccinated.

While I see Royal Caribbean trying to use this as a way around Florida Law, some Floridian (or their governor) is going to end up suing Royal Caribbean over this and I don't think this shields them at all. Legally it sounds more like if you sail from Florida, to follow both laws you would not be able to include the US Virgin Islands as a destination for the time being.

If that is true, then how can planes fly out of Florida to countries that require vaccination?

 

[TXcruzer]

1 hour ago, Aulayan said:

I'm no lawyer but I don't see how this is around Florida Law.  Florida Law states that cruise lines can't ask for vaccine status.  St. Thomas states you can't come here if anyone over 12 is not vaccinated.

While I see Royal Caribbean trying to use this as a way around Florida Law, some Floridian (or their governor) is going to end up suing Royal Caribbean over this and I don't think this shields them at all. Legally it sounds more like if you sail from Florida, to follow both laws you would not be able to include the US Virgin Islands as a destination for the time being.

How can you sue Royal for a USVI requirement?

 

Spoiler Alert:  You can not

[CrznTxn]

If you are flying to a country that requires vaccination then you must present documentation that you are during check-in, no asking, a requirement or you don't go. AA uses VeriFly where you upload proof of vaccination to fast track through TSA. If you do not use it then you must show proof or you don't go to that country.

Royal has already determined that they will continue to visit USVI and have informed their customers that if they are not vaccinated then they will be offered a different itinerary or refund. They decided to not visit St Kitts due to the restriction that only 700 passengers may visit from any ship and they did not want to play gatekeeper and tell some passengers they cannot get off.

[WAAAYTOOO]

Just make it a sea day.  Not a big deal at all.

[Jill]

This is about to get interesting. Ultimate game of Chess. 
 

I’ve got St Thomas on my October Symphony. Wouldn’t break my heart if it gets changed. Been there a dozen times. 
 

Given the current situation, I don’t blame them one bit. They can always ask for US Gov’t financial assistance. Kind of sad that the US has kazillion doses bought of AZ. How about we send them to our territories? 

[Jill]

13 minutes ago, WAAAYTOOO said:

Just make it a sea day.  Not a big deal at all.

I’ll take that! Especially on an oasis class 

[AshleyDillo]

13 minutes ago, WAAAYTOOO said:

Just make it a sea day.  Not a big deal at all.

I don't know why they couldn't just flag it so unvaccinated couldn't get off the ship in St. Thomas.  But I guess they're going to flat out refuse the ship if it's not all eligible aged folks vaccinated so that isn't even an option.

[WAAAYTOOO]

So what are the options (for Royal) if this requirement is sustained ?

1.  They give in and have to refund the money for anyone who is considered unvaccinated.  This is money coming directly out of Royal’s pocket.  A few pissed off customers.

2.  Royal rearranges the schedule and finds a port that will accept the ship.  It’s a huge hassle for the schedulers but no refunds.  Probably highly unlikely for close-in sailings.  A few pissed off customers (maybe).

3.  They say “F” St Thomas and schedule a sea day.  No refunds b/c schedule changes do not qualify for a refund.  A few pissed off customers.

[Jill]

11 minutes ago, WAAAYTOOO said:

So what are the options (for Royal) if this requirement is sustained ?

1.  They give in and have to refund the money for anyone who is considered unvaccinated.  This is money coming directly out of Royal’s pocket.  A few pissed off customers.

2.  Royal rearranges the schedule and finds a port that will accept the ship.  It’s a huge hassle for the schedulers but no refunds.  Probably highly unlikely for close-in sailings.  A few pissed off customers (maybe).

3.  They say “F” St Thomas and schedule a sea day.  No refunds b/c schedule changes do not qualify for a refund.  A few pissed off customers.

As long as it stops at one port outside US, option 3 could easily happen 

[LizzyBee23]

3 hours ago, danv3 said:

I hope more ports will impose such vaccination requirements since the lines (and Florida) are unwilling. 

Southern and Eastern Caribbean for the vaccinated, the Bahamas and western Caribbean for the unvaccinated. 

Only kind of a joke. Wonder what the market forces will be for this kind of thing over the short term. If it becomes too widespread, unvaccinated cruisers may eventually be stuck with 3-night and 4-night CocoCay/Nassau back-to-backs.

[karl_nj]

12 minutes ago, LizzyBee23 said:

Southern and Eastern Caribbean for the vaccinated, the Bahamas and western Caribbean for the unvaccinated. 

Only kind of a joke. Wonder what the market forces will be for this kind of thing over the short term. If it becomes too widespread, unvaccinated cruisers may eventually be stuck with 3-night and 4-night CocoCay/Nassau back-to-backs.

Until the Bahamas decides they only want vaccinated tourists. 

[ChrisK2793]

3 hours ago, Aulayan said:

I'm no lawyer but I don't see how this is around Florida Law.  Florida Law states that cruise lines can't ask for vaccine status.  St. Thomas states you can't come here if anyone over 12 is not vaccinated.

While I see Royal Caribbean trying to use this as a way around Florida Law, some Floridian (or their governor) is going to end up suing Royal Caribbean over this and I don't think this shields them at all. Legally it sounds more like if you sail from Florida, to follow both laws you would not be able to include the US Virgin Islands as a destination for the time being.

‘Carnival is already not letting you on their ships if you’re over 12 and not vaccinated ……. Florida hasn’t done anything to them ….. so RCL can probably do it as well and nothing will happen to them either.

 

[12thman]

5 hours ago, Cannon G said:

We are sailing on Allure of the Seas on 8/8 and just received word that all guests 12 and up must be fully vaccinated. This is due to the USVI not allowing any ships to dock with unvaccinated 12 years old and up.
 

This is a major change if the email is correct.

Are you still planning to go?

[Cannon G]

17 minutes ago, 12thman said:

Are you still planning to go?

Yes. Can’t wait. 

[12thman]

10 minutes ago, Cannon G said:

Yes. Can’t wait. 

Have a great time!!

[Ampurp85]

My Oct 31 has this itinerary, as we really only planned to get off at CocoCay and are all vaxxed, it isn't a big deal. But I can see this reducing Allure to that 30-ish percent capacity...on top of the 3 day-before negative test, mask and other things that will spring up. 

[ChrisK2793]

1 hour ago, WAAAYTOOO said:

So what are the options (for Royal) if this requirement is sustained ?

1.  They give in and have to refund the money for anyone who is considered unvaccinated.  This is money coming directly out of Royal’s pocket.  A few pissed off customers.

2.  Royal rearranges the schedule and finds a port that will accept the ship.  It’s a huge hassle for the schedulers but no refunds.  Probably highly unlikely for close-in sailings.  A few pissed off customers (maybe).

3.  They say “F” St Thomas and schedule a sea day.  No refunds b/c schedule changes do not qualify for a refund.  A few pissed off customers.

Except for options 2 and 3,  “Cruise With Confidence” allows anyone to cancel up to 48 hours before for any reason for a 100% FCC ……… Remember unvaccinated under 12 traveling with vaccinated adults can still go on the cruise ….. Let’s say 20% (maybe less) of the age 12+ passengers are unvaccinated and would be refunded …….. on the flip side, what happens if a huge majority of the vaccinated passengers start canceling cruises because ports are being cancelled or changed to less desirable ones to accommodate the unvaccinated?  

Yes, Royal will still have their money and they have to take another cruise at another time with their FCC …….. but I’m willing to bet that RCL has crunched the numbers and decided it’s better financially for them to 100% cash refund the unvaccinated than to take the risk of an undetermined number of vaccinated passengers cancelling for an FCC because their ports are being cancelled to accommodate unvaccinated passengers.  RCL wouldn’t have made this decision to keep the port and remove the unvaccinated from the cruise if they didn’t think it was in their best financial interest.  Money decides everything.

 

[dswallow]

If I were Royal Caribbean, I'd be looking at adding a St. Thomas visit on every sailing from a Florida port.

[TXcruzer]

12 hours ago, Jill said:

This is about to get interesting. Ultimate game of Chess. 
 

I’ve got St Thomas on my October Symphony. Wouldn’t break my heart if it gets changed. Been there a dozen times. 
 

Given the current situation, I don’t blame them one bit. They can always ask for US Gov’t financial assistance. Kind of sad that the US has kazillion doses bought of AZ. How about we send them to our territories? 

Because AZ has not received, nor even applied for, FDA approval.

[LovetoCruise87]

We are scheduled for Aug 22 with this itinerary. The only two excursion we have are St. Kitts and Coco Cay. So any change is ok with me. At this point we are not going to be canceling or rebooking. Too close and too excited to do that!

[LovetoCruise87]

Also the way I read it, this was the officials of the US Virgin Islands implementing it. No cruise ships with unvaccinated passengers will be allowed to stop at St. Thoma

[SpeedNoodles]

12 hours ago, Ampurp85 said:

My Oct 31 has this itinerary, as we really only planned to get off at CocoCay and are all vaxxed, it isn't a big deal. But I can see this reducing Allure to that 30-ish percent capacity...on top of the 3 day-before negative test, mask and other things that will spring up. 

Agreed - I'm totally ok with that.

[MrK1ttens]

13 hours ago, WAAAYTOOO said:

So what are the options (for Royal) if this requirement is sustained ?

1.  They give in and have to refund the money for anyone who is considered unvaccinated.  This is money coming directly out of Royal’s pocket.  A few pissed off customers.

2.  Royal rearranges the schedule and finds a port that will accept the ship.  It’s a huge hassle for the schedulers but no refunds.  Probably highly unlikely for close-in sailings.  A few pissed off customers (maybe).

3.  They say “F” St Thomas and schedule a sea day.  No refunds b/c schedule changes do not qualify for a refund.  A few pissed off customers.

I’d say that #1 is the most likely. Considering Royal Caribbean themselves have said that the ships end up being around 90% vaccinated anyway, they probably don’t care too much about losing the unvaccinated. 
 

#2 & #3 affect a lot more people than #1, so I would imagine they’d take the route of least annoyance to customers here. 

[Falling_Down]

21 minutes ago, MrK1ttens said:

I’d say that #1 is the most likely. Considering Royal Caribbean themselves have said that the ships end up being around 90% vaccinated anyway, they probably don’t care too much about losing the unvaccinated. 
 

#2 & #3 affect a lot more people than #1, so I would imagine they’d take the route of least annoyance to customers here. 

Agreed. The financial loss from the unvaccinated cancelling would be minimal compared to the loss from both vaccinated and unvaccinated I would imagine. As terrible as this sounds...it also may attract those who are uncomfortable sailing with unvaccinated 12 and up's filling up those empty rooms.