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Celebrity Cruises Will Resume Cruises From Florida in June


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Yeah, it’s terrible to be around people with dumb theories about Covid like people who believe wearing a cloth mask protects them from an aerosolized virus or people who think children should have bee

I would happily cruise with 'the great un-vaxxed'.  Just as long as I could cruise, the risks are minuscule!"!

I am disappointed that Royal Caribbean didn't go the vaccinated route. Forget the test cruises, I don't want to be on a cruise with people who aren't vaccinated, because the reason they probably didn'

This is the way a great cruise line does it. Deliberate, aggressive, transparent. There's been none of the silly teaser videos, no confusion about sailing plans, just straight forward, this is business. I've posted on the Celebrity thread that I know exactly what's happening and how it will happen on my booked cruise out of Athens on July 9th. 

@Matt said: Unlike Celebrity, Royal Caribbean will not be able to reach the 95% mandate of passengers being vaccinated by the CDC to skip test cruises.

That's not really the case. Mr. Fain, or whoever is running the clown show there, chose to go with a hybrid mix of vaxed and unwaxed passengers and to do the test crises to get certified by the CDC. From a practical standpoint that's potentially putting up unnecessary barriers, e.g., what if the CDC says on the first go, "not good enough, do it again?" From a health health standpoint, I think that creates potential for problems. Although the risk is small, an infection - just one or two - is possible, more possible with a hybrid mix of passengers and unvaccinated people on excursions, catching COVID, in a port with circulating virus and brining it back on board ship. That would be disastrous. I get the family orientation of RCL but get the boats with vaxed passengers on line and go from there. 

Egg on your face Mr. Fain.

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35 minutes ago, JeffB said:

This is the way a great cruise line does it. Deliberate, aggressive, transparent. There's been none of the silly teaser videos, no confusion about sailing plans, just straight forward, this is business. I've posted on the Celebrity thread that I know exactly what's happening and how it will happen on my booked cruise out of Athens on July 9th. 

@Matt said: Unlike Celebrity, Royal Caribbean will not be able to reach the 95% mandate of passengers being vaccinated by the CDC to skip test cruises.

That's not really the case. Mr. Fain, or whoever is running the clown show there, chose to go with a hybrid mix of vaxed and unwaxed passengers and to do the test crises to get certified by the CDC. From a practical standpoint that's potentially putting up unnecessary barriers, e.g., what if the CDC says on the first go, "not good enough, do it again?" From a health health standpoint, I think that creates potential for problems. Although the risk is small, an infection - just one or two - is possible, more possible with a hybrid mix of passengers and unvaccinated people on excursions, catching COVID, in a port with circulating virus and brining it back on board ship. That would be disastrous. I get the family orientation of RCL but get the boats with vaxed passengers on line and go from there. 

Egg on your face Mr. Fain.

To each their own

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2 hours ago, JeffB said:

This is the way a great cruise line does it. Deliberate, aggressive, transparent. There's been none of the silly teaser videos, no confusion about sailing plans, just straight forward, this is business. I've posted on the Celebrity thread that I know exactly what's happening and how it will happen on my booked cruise out of Athens on July 9th. 

@Matt said: Unlike Celebrity, Royal Caribbean will not be able to reach the 95% mandate of passengers being vaccinated by the CDC to skip test cruises.

That's not really the case. Mr. Fain, or whoever is running the clown show there, chose to go with a hybrid mix of vaxed and unwaxed passengers and to do the test crises to get certified by the CDC. From a practical standpoint that's potentially putting up unnecessary barriers, e.g., what if the CDC says on the first go, "not good enough, do it again?" From a health health standpoint, I think that creates potential for problems. Although the risk is small, an infection - just one or two - is possible, more possible with a hybrid mix of passengers and unvaccinated people on excursions, catching COVID, in a port with circulating virus and brining it back on board ship. That would be disastrous. I get the family orientation of RCL but get the boats with vaxed passengers on line and go from there. 

Egg on your face Mr. Fain.

I am disappointed that Royal Caribbean didn't go the vaccinated route. Forget the test cruises, I don't want to be on a cruise with people who aren't vaccinated, because the reason they probably didn't get vaccinated is NOT because of health reasons or religion or whatever. They are just anti-vaxxers and have all these dumb theories about the vaccine. Plus the risk is higher of an outbreak if you mix vax'd and unvax'd... it may backfire for Royal Caribbean and they may regret not going the vaccinated route. We will see. Luckily my next cruise isn't until November so hopefully things are better by then in terms of all this craziness.

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2 hours ago, johnt83 said:

I am disappointed that Royal Caribbean didn't go the vaccinated route. Forget the test cruises, I don't want to be on a cruise with people who aren't vaccinated, because the reason they probably didn't get vaccinated is NOT because of health reasons or religion or whatever. They are just anti-vaxxers and have all these dumb theories about the vaccine. Plus the risk is higher of an outbreak if you mix vax'd and unvax'd... it may backfire for Royal Caribbean and they may regret not going the vaccinated route. We will see. Luckily my next cruise isn't until November so hopefully things are better by then in terms of all this craziness.

I would happily cruise with 'the great un-vaxxed'.  Just as long as I could cruise, the risks are minuscule!"!

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5 hours ago, johnt83 said:

I am disappointed that Royal Caribbean didn't go the vaccinated route. Forget the test cruises, I don't want to be on a cruise with people who aren't vaccinated, because the reason they probably didn't get vaccinated is NOT because of health reasons or religion or whatever. They are just anti-vaxxers and have all these dumb theories about the vaccine. Plus the risk is higher of an outbreak if you mix vax'd and unvax'd... it may backfire for Royal Caribbean and they may regret not going the vaccinated route. We will see. Luckily my next cruise isn't until November so hopefully things are better by then in terms of all this craziness.

Yeah, it’s terrible to be around people with dumb theories about Covid like people who believe wearing a cloth mask protects them from an aerosolized virus or people who think children should have been kept out of schools. People who wear masks outside. People who really believe Covid was first transmitted from an animal to humans. People that believe a higher rate of people are hospitalized from Covid than actually are. 
 

The point being is there is wild theories on both sides. Just because people chose not to get vaccinated don’t mean they are anti- vaxxers . Maybe they recovered from Covid, have natural immunity, etc. 

and guess what? On your November cruise, there will be unvaccinated people on that ship… oh, the horror!!!! Whenever you cruise beyond November it will be the same thing. I would suggest you cancel any cruises so you can be consistent with your beliefs 
 


 

 

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4 hours ago, icf75 said:

I note the article states US guests (because of the current travel restrictions). Does anyone know what Celebrities policy is for non-US children and vaccinations?

Here's the quote and, correct, its from the author and does not reflect Celebrity policy:

All Celebrity ships will sail with a vaccinated crew. U.S. guests ages 16 and older must be fully vaccinated and, as of August 1, 2021, all U.S. guests ages 12 and older must be fully vaccinated.

This is from the Celebrity web site in the section Healthy at Sea:

All guests ages 16 years and older must be fully vaccinated with all Covid-19 vaccine doses administered at least 14 days prior to sailing. As of August 1, 2021, all US Guests age 12 and older must be fully vaccinated. For UK residents, all guests 18 and over must be fully vaccinated with all Covid-19 vaccine doses administered at least 14 days prior to sailing. Crew members onboard will be vaccinated.

No distinction is made at the Celebrity web site between US and non-US guests. Everyone has to be vaccinated to sail

Another point: Regardless of which path a cruise line choses to purse between 95/98 and test cruises, the CDC requires each ship to be approved to sail by applying to, in fact, sail. There are two sources that apply to and define what this means. They are the Federal Register that contains the actual Framework for Conditional Sailing and Initial Phase COVID-19 Testing Requirements for Protection of Crew and Passengers (October 20th 2020) and the COVID-19 Operations Manual for Simulated and Restricted Voyages under the Framework for Conditional Sailing Order at the CDC web site (last updated May26th 2021). I've provided links to all the applicable documents below. If you really want to be informed about what is behind the CSO and the re-start, I recommend you at least scan them.

The Framework for Conditional Sailing Order at the CDC web site (last updated May26th 2021) is the most current source and I found it interesting that the section regarding permission to pursue the 98/95 pathway was just published yesterday via an update to the CDC source! Wow. The cruise lines have to be fully informed of both of these sources to establish what they need to do to apply to the CDC for, obtain approval from the CDC and actually sail. I've just read both of them. What I found interesting is that it appears that the Vessel Sanitation Program (VSP) is a central component to the CSO. A lot of the stuff in the CSO is just a regurgitation of the provisions of the VSP that cruise ships are already in compliance with. That does not mean there are not a lot of hoops to jump through. It means that many of the hoops have already been cleared.

TBF to Mr. Fain and RCL, they simply chose another route not any more complex or burdensome than the 95/98 route. What it does mean is that RCL's startup is going to be slower and take longer and this may very well comport with RCL's operations plans and are different than Celebrity's. My post last night was too harsh wrt to RCL and Mr. Fain and to congratulatory of Celebrity's 

https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2020/11/04/2020-24477/framework-for-conditional-sailing-and-initial-phase-covid-19-testing-requirements-for-protection-of

https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/05/10/2021-09895/conditional-sailing-order-technical-instructions-and-operations-manual

https://www.cdc.gov/quarantine/cruise/covid19-operations-manual-cso.html

https://www.cdc.gov/nceh/vsp/desc/aboutvsp.htm

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51 minutes ago, jticarruthers said:

Count me in with you. No concerns about cruising with the un-vaxxed no matter what their reason.

It is absolutely correct to note that the risk of contracting COVID on board a cruise ship is very small and that risk is only slightly higher for a hybrid mix of passengers than it is for a fully (95%) vaccinated passenger manifest.

I think we all know this and most of us, including me, are willing to cruise in the hybrid setting. Where the risk is the highest is for the lines themselves. The bottom line is that they can't afford ANY infections for reasons that have been discussed here. So, for them, they are trying to build a zero risk environment. Hats off to all the cruise lines for all that they are doing to achieve this as closely as they can. We are all going to be a lot better off from an infection control standpoint as cruises slowly but steadily return.  

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21 minutes ago, UNCFanatik said:

How will this sailing deal with Desantis' vaccine passport law? 

How is Celebrity planning to deal with this? 

Everyone is wondering this and no one really knows what to expect.

Cruise lines certainly havent said anything.

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As far as the vaccine passport law Desantis' has, it it sort of like splitting hairs. His law says companies in Florida cannot ask to see such a thing. Most cruise lines are international companies so it would not really apply to them. Also asking to see a vaccine card is not the same as a vaccination passport. I think many cruise lines know this, so it might not be high on their list.

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1 hour ago, JeffB said:

It is absolutely correct to note that the risk of contracting COVID on board a cruise ship is very small and that risk is only slightly higher for a hybrid mix of passengers than it is for a fully (95%) vaccinated passenger manifest.

I think we all know this and most of us, including me, are willing to cruise in the hybrid setting. Where the risk is the highest is for the lines themselves. The bottom line is that they can't afford ANY infections for reasons that have been discussed here. So, for them, they are trying to build a zero risk environment. Hats off to all the cruise lines for all that they are doing to achieve this as closely as they can. We are all going to be a lot better off from an infection control standpoint as cruises slowly but steadily return.  

I agree with your statement but wish it wasnt true.

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2 hours ago, Matt said:

Everyone is wondering this and no one really knows what to expect.

Cruise lines certainly havent said anything.

Forgive a dumb question here, but if the law goes into effect July 1st, and their first sailing is June 26th, are they off the hook for this first sailing? I know that doesn't touch any of the issues for the 2nd sailing on, and you're right back at square one, but does this really apply to the 2nd sailing? And then, I agree, probably some negotiating going on behind closed doors, but at least they could get one in, if they had to split hairs?

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12 minutes ago, nhilding10 said:

Forgive a dumb question here, but if the law goes into effect July 1st, and their first sailing is June 26th, are they off the hook for this first sailing? I know that doesn't touch any of the issues for the 2nd sailing on, and you're right back at square one, but does this really apply to the 2nd sailing? And then, I agree, probably some negotiating going on behind closed doors, but at least they could get one in, if they had to split hairs?

Yep...sounds right.

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2 hours ago, UNCFanatik said:

How will this sailing deal with Desantis' vaccine passport law? 

How is Celebrity planning to deal with this? 

Here is the law that everyone is concerned with:

read: 1121 381.00316 COVID-19 vaccine documentation.— 1122 (1) A business entity, as defined in s. 768.38 to include 1123 any business operating in this state, may not require patrons or 1124 customers to provide any documentation certifying COVID-19 1125 vaccination or post-infection recovery to gain access to, entry 1126 upon, or service from the business operations in this state. 1127 This subsection does not otherwise restrict businesses from 1128 instituting screening protocols consistent with authoritative or 1129 controlling government-issued guidance to protect public health.

Notice the last sentence. The cruise lines can require screening, which is what I believe I saw last week, but you do not have to be screened if you have proof of vaccination.

 

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34 minutes ago, nhilding10 said:

Forgive a dumb question here, but if the law goes into effect July 1st, and their first sailing is June 26th, are they off the hook for this first sailing? I know that doesn't touch any of the issues for the 2nd sailing on, and you're right back at square one, but does this really apply to the 2nd sailing? And then, I agree, probably some negotiating going on behind closed doors, but at least they could get one in, if they had to split hairs?

Florida is still under the EO that becomes law on the first. In other words no they are still on the hook.

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Desantis chimes in...

https://www.abcactionnews.com/news/state/governor-desantis-responds-to-celebrity-cruises-vaccine-requirement-for-fl-cruises

 

DeSantis says the vaccine requirements put in place by the cruise line violate the spirit of the Governor’s Emergency Order 21-81, which prohibits vaccine passports and protects the fundamental rights of Floridians – including the right to medical privacy. The governor also says the policy would be a violation of Florida’s recently enacted law banning vaccine passports, SB 2006, effective July 1.

"Companies doing business in Florida, including Celebrity Cruises, should immediately cease to impose such discriminatory policies upon individuals. Companies that violate this law would be subject to a fine of $5,000 each time they require a customer to present a 'vaccine passport' for service," DeSantis said.

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1 hour ago, cruisinghawg said:

Here is the law that everyone is concerned with:

read: 1121 381.00316 COVID-19 vaccine documentation.— 1122 (1) A business entity, as defined in s. 768.38 to include 1123 any business operating in this state, may not require patrons or 1124 customers to provide any documentation certifying COVID-19 1125 vaccination or post-infection recovery to gain access to, entry 1126 upon, or service from the business operations in this state. 1127 This subsection does not otherwise restrict businesses from 1128 instituting screening protocols consistent with authoritative or 1129 controlling government-issued guidance to protect public health.

Notice the last sentence. The cruise lines can require screening, which is what I believe I saw last week, but you do not have to be screened if you have proof of vaccination.

 

So one way to potentially get around this law is to say "XYZ screening protocol is required to cruise, but if you voluntarily provide proof of complete vaccination, you may skip XYZ screening protocol.  To be clear, no one is required to provide proof of vaccination."  

Downside there is it doesn't guarantee a fully-vaccinated (or even largely fully vaccinated) ship.  

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