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CDC Guidance for US cruises- 98% Crew, 95% Pax vaccinated. Are you OK with that?


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8 minutes ago, 0_0 said:

Cancellations will mount quickly if these requirements remain for fully vaccinated passengers.

 

I'm guessing more cancellations would occur if vaccines are NOT required. People want to vacation safely.

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9 minutes ago, 0_0 said:

If the CDC continues on this path without intervention from the Federal Court hearing Florida's (Alaska, Texas) case it's a guarentee they will choose to homeport the majority of their ships outside the US/CDC jurisdiction for the foreseeable future.

I think that is the plan.  

No one at the CDC is happy the pandemic happened but they are taking the opportunity presented to purge cruising from the US.   

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11 minutes ago, alamode123 said:

I'm guessing more cancellations would occur if vaccines are NOT required. People want to vacation safely.

It's all a moot point because, vaccines aside; the CSO is unworkable. The shoreside quarantine agreements alone make it nearly impossible to accomplish the goal.

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I'm upset with they way the CDC is handling this, not just in terms of us being able to cruise again, but I think of all the jobs that would be permanently lost in all of the US ports if the Cruise lines decide to move their ship off shore away from the US and CDC jurisdiction. 

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43 minutes ago, twangster said:

 

No one at the CDC is happy the pandemic happened but they are taking the opportunity presented to purge cruising from the US.   

Why would this be the goal of the CDC? 

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Since NCL needs 90 days to be ready to sail from U.S. ports and assuming Royal is in the same position will Royal be ready for November sailings? Since Phase 4 hasn't been released how can the CDC say you can sail under these terms? Will they change the requirements at phase 4? 

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26 minutes ago, Eirc said:

Why would this be the goal of the CDC? 

Just speculating, but I can think of a couple motives, none flattering.

  1. The scientists and/or bureaucrats at the CDC work in obscurity.  Now they are in the limelight.  It's simply more fun to be in the limelight. Therefore, they have a personal interest in keeping this whole thing going as long a possible.
  2. Obama had an Executive order making the primary goal of all federal departments to fight global warming.  CDC might be anticipating that order will be reinstated. If so, they've already eliminated a CO2 emitter from the USA. Keeping it out would be a feather in their cap.

If this speculation is correct, they would be wise to recognize that every day they continue to play these games is one more day they lose the trust and respect of the American people.  Once trust and respect is gone, they'll still exist as an organization (after all, nothing is more permanent than a government agency), but it won't have any real power. i.e. no fun anymore.

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20 minutes ago, steverk said:

Just speculating, but I can think of a couple motives, none flattering.

  1. The scientists and/or bureaucrats at the CDC work in obscurity.  Now they are in the limelight.  It's simply more fun to be in the limelight. Therefore, they have a personal interest in keeping this whole thing going as long a possible.
  2. Obama had an Executive order making the primary goal of all federal departments to fight global warming.  CDC might be anticipating that order will be reinstated. If so, they've already eliminated a CO2 emitter from the USA. Keeping it out would be a feather in their cap.

If this speculation is correct, they would be wise to recognize that every day they continue to play these games is one more day they lose the trust and respect of the American people.  Once trust and respect is gone, they'll still exist as an organization (after all, nothing is more permanent than a government agency), but it won't have any real power. i.e. no fun anymore.

Well, they've lost my trust already. Whenever I see an article that mentions "CDC" in the headline, I immediately assume that it is false, overstated, or most likely alarmist. 

Also, why do we treat CDC guidance as gospel this year? No one has had a problem with medium rare steaks or eggs over easy before, and CDC guidance has been against those for years!

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8 minutes ago, nate91 said:

Well, they've lost my trust already. Whenever I see an article that mentions "CDC" in the headline, I immediately assume that it is false, overstated, or most likely alarmist. 

Also, why do we treat CDC guidance as gospel this year? No one has had a problem with medium rare steaks or eggs over easy before, and CDC guidance has been against those for years!

They lost mine after about a week of the pandemic, but I guess some people are more trusting of "scientists" than I.

Anyway, I was responding to a post that asked what their motive could be. I only speculated.

I'm sure the CDC has convinced itself that they have our best interests at heart. Who knows? Maybe they do! I've just come to the conclusion that they are deluding themselves.

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56 minutes ago, nate91 said:


Also, why do we treat CDC guidance as gospel this year? No one has had a problem with medium rare steaks or eggs over easy before, and CDC guidance has been against those for years!

YES!! 1000 times yes! and dont eat raw cookie dough with eggs in it!

Just like the travel department makes travel advisories that US citizens can take in consideration and make their own decisions. I have been to Mexico before when the travel advisory said that I was in grave danger from Cartels. And yet....

 

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7 hours ago, alamode123 said:

I want everywhere possible to require a vaccine passport for entry when they are available. Flights, restaurants, theme parks, international travel.

It's safer for everyone, and would give an incentive for antivaxxers to change.

I am fully vaccinated but I 100% disagree with your position on this.  No disrespect but COVID is a virus nothing more and as much as they would have people believe it is so different from the flu it really isn't.  There are so many variants of flu which is why scientist have to change the flu vaccine every year and encourage people to get their flu shot.  COVID is no different it is here to stay and will continually mutate requiring booster shots but it should be a choice not a requirement and keep in mind 99% of people who contracted COVID survived just like the flu. 

The idea that we now need vaccine passports to keep people safe from a virus is ludicrous and vaccine passports will just strengthen the antivax movement.  The government state or federal should not have the power to take away peoples freedoms or restore freedoms based on a persons vaccination status.   

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51 minutes ago, smokeybandit said:

CLIA with about as diplomatic of a "oh hell no" as could possibly be written

 

 

 

How many versions before this one was tweeted?

My money is on about 47 versions.

  • CLIA Executive Assistant: "Whoa!  You can't say that!"
  • CLIA Executive: "Okay, take the F word out.  How about now?"
  • CLIA Executive Assistant: "Still no"
  • CLIA Executive: "Okay, take "morons" out.  How about now?"
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I can't get this song out of my head.  

Everytime I read "CDC" in these forums this song comes flooding into head...

Why do you build me up (build me up) buttercup, baby
Just to let me down (let me down) and mess me around?
And then worst of all (worst of all) you never call, baby
When you say you will (say you will) but I love you still
I need you (I need you) more than anyone, darlin'
You know that I have from the start
So build me up (build me up) buttercup, don't break my heart

"I'll be over at ten," you told me time and again
But you're late, I wait around and then (bah dah dah)
I went to the door, I can't take any more
It's not you, you let me down again

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2 hours ago, JasonOasis said:

I am fully vaccinated but I 100% disagree with your position on this.  No disrespect but COVID is a virus nothing more and as much as they would have people believe it is so different from the flu it really isn't.  There are so many variants of flu which is why scientist have to change the flu vaccine every year and encourage people to get their flu shot.  COVID is no different it is here to stay and will continually mutate requiring booster shots but it should be a choice not a requirement and keep in mind 99% of people who contracted COVID survived just like the flu. 

The idea that we now need vaccine passports to keep people safe from a virus is ludicrous and vaccine passports will just strengthen the antivax movement.  The government state or federal should not have the power to take away peoples freedoms or restore freedoms based on a persons vaccination status.   

As of yesterday, there are probably 593,000 in the US who (if they were still alive), might disagree with your opinion on, "it's not different from the flu."

It's very different from the flu.  Given it's lethality, it makes no sense to pack people into a congregate setting like a cruise ship without requiring proof-of-vaccination.  Sure, boosters will be required as the virus mutates in the wild, but if you want the CDC to allow cruising again?

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18 minutes ago, cruisellama said:

Q2 financials will be further depressed with bringing on crew to start vaccinations and quarantine.  Then  a delayed Q3 start with delayed opportunity for revenue.  Hope those law suites can move the needle.

Q3 and Q4 financials were already toast and so are 2022 Q1 to Q4 compared to prior years.

They have little choice but to proceed on the premise of pursuing the elusive CSO certificate to sail regardless how absurd that may look.

If they don't try that is far worse for investors to ponder.  "Why didn't you try?"

Right now the CDC might as well add every guest must wear orange coveralls with black numbers on the back identifying each prisoner guest and the cruise industry would still need need to try.  

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27 minutes ago, cruisellama said:

Lines will need to cultivate more overseas starts to stay viable to play the long game with minimum to no US participation.  

Probably but the numbers don't work in their favor.

The majority of cruisers are based in the US.  Adding flights costs to the quintessential cruise target family of four will dramatically reduce the target audience.  Add overseas vaccine and testing requirements and that target market grows smaller.  Multigenerational families?  Yeah, right.  

What they need to do is find an approach the reduces the bleeding even though everyone in the industry knows simply stemming blood loss won't cure the ailment we know of as the CDC, it just keeps the patient alive a little longer until a cure finally arrives.

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15 minutes ago, twangster said:

Probably but the numbers don't work in their favor.

The majority of cruisers are based in the US.  Adding flights costs to the quintessential cruise target family of four will dramatically reduce the target audience.  Add overseas vaccine and testing requirements and that target market grows smaller.  Multigenerational families?  Yeah, right.  

What they need to do is find an approach the reduces the bleeding even though everyone in the industry knows simply stemming blood loss won't cure the ailment we know of as the CDC, it just keeps the patient alive a little longer until a cure finally arrives.

Add to the mix the requirements passports. Sure most one time cruisers would rather not pay for something that might be used just once.

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20 minutes ago, CGTLH said:

Add to the mix the requirements passports. Sure most one time cruisers would rather not pay for something that might be used just once.

The is no such thing as a "vaccine passport."  There is the card you get after your first vaccination (and the 2nd one gets recorded if you got the AZ or Moderna one vs.the J&J one-shot-and done).  That data eventually gets reported upstream to the CDC so there is an electronic record.

You don't pay for it.  You don't pay to get vaccinated, either.  Providers like CVS/Walgreens etc. may take down your insurance info to back bill your insurance (if you have it) for the cost of administering the vaccine to you, but your cost is zero.

I'm sure there are people here old enough to remember "yellow cards", where you had to provide a vaccine record to cross certain international borders.  Technically a WHO "International certificate of vaccination or prophylaxis".  I needed one as a kid to travel in Africa.  They still exist.  This is nothing new.

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10 minutes ago, mk-ultra said:

The is no such thing as a "vaccine passport."  There is the card you get after your first vaccination (and the 2nd one gets recorded if you got the AZ Moderna on vs.the J&J one-shot-and done).  That data eventually gets reported upstream to the CDC so there is an electronic record.

You don't pay for it.  You don't pay to get vaccinated, either.  Providers like CVS/Walgreens etc. may take down your insurance info to back bill your insurance (if you have it) for the cost of administering the vaccine to you, but your cost is zero.

I'm sure there are people here old enough to remember "yellow cards", where you had to provide a vaccine record to cross certain international borders.  Technically a WHO "International certificate of vaccination or prophylaxis".  I needed one as a kid to travel in Africa.  They still exist.  This is nothing new.

Comment had nothing to do with a vaccine passport. Talking about https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/passports.html/

The kind that is required for international travel via air.

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