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Do you think that the CDC has even looked at the new safety plans in place, established by Royal Caribbean, NCL, and Carnival?

    It seems that their requirements are very outdated and out of touch.  As far as I know, the CDC has not mentioned any safety measures that cruise lines have taken.

  (Maybe someone knows more about what the CDC actually knows in regards to cruise lines safety policies. There must be an explanation; is it lack of knowledge or something else?)

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I think part of it is theater. The CDC under the direction of the current administration is not inclined to do anything that would indicate a semi-return to normalcy for several reasons which have far more to do with politics than science. Its becoming more and more obvious that the CDC does not believe that the US populace are capable of their own risk mitigation. The CDC does not want to signal that the pandemic is coming to an end which lifting the no sail order would do. 

Meanwhile, cruise adjacent US jobs continue to be lost and the unemployed workers are suffering. 

Any hope I had because of all the recent pressure being out on the CDC to lift the no sail order before Oct 31 is starting to fade. 

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No. They hate this industry. They are miffed at the audacity of our questioning their motives. They need to be removed from this equation, I fear no matter what the industry puts into practice it will never be good enough. I want to sail, but my heart hurts for every person who makes their living tethered to this industry. Dog and pony shows need to stop, CDC needs to leave it alone already, been in an airport or airplane lately? Disney World? Simply disgraceful their lack of positive partnership. 

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55 minutes ago, Matt said:

Not seriously.

I think they're aware of it, but they are hung up on what happened with Diamond Princess.

Agree, the biggest holdup I'd say is the agreement with ports to take in infected passengers. CDC really doesn't want the same black eye from the Grand Princess happening again. Same time the industry as a whole doesn't want the same thing to happen again.

 

Thought this article was a great summary of the pain for taking in passengers:  https://www.travelweekly.com/Cruise-Travel/Fine-print-with-a-huge-impact-Ports-struggle-with-CDC-terms

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27 minutes ago, CGTLH said:

Agree, the biggest holdup I'd say is the agreement with ports to take in infected passengers. CDC really doesn't want the same black eye from the Grand Princess happening again. Same time the industry as a whole doesn't want the same thing to happen again.

Which is ridiculous since the likelihood of needing to use those agreements is near zero

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The CDC is in a "damned-if-you-do-damned-if-you-don't" situation with this pandemic.  They're being damned right now for the restrictions/suspensions they have imposed on the cruise industry.  If, heaven forbid, another outbreak happens on just one cruise ship, guess which direction fingers will be pointed at.  I understand why they've chosen to err on the side of caution.   Of course, from the viewpoint of cruise lovers like us, the CDC is erring on the side of TOO MUCH caution.

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28 minutes ago, HeWhoWaits said:

If this is their reasoning, EVERY nursing home in the country should have been shut down because of the original outbreak in Seattle. And NONE of them should be open again.

CDC isnt in charge of nursing homes ... its probably a good thing that the CDC isnt in charge of much ... if they were i think we would have all spent the last twelve months loaded into bubble wrap pods, with integrated life support gear, fed intravenously, etc.

 

 

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58 minutes ago, PG Cruiser said:

The CDC is in a "damned-if-you-do-damned-if-you-don't" situation with this pandemic.  They're being damned right now for the restrictions/suspensions they have imposed on the cruise industry.  If, heaven forbid, another outbreak happens on just one cruise ship, guess which direction fingers will be pointed at.  I understand why they've chosen to err on the side of caution.   Of course, from the viewpoint of cruise lovers like us, the CDC is erring on the side of TOO MUCH caution.

I can understand wanting to err on the side of caution when it comes to public health but what frustrates me personally is the lack of consistency and contradictions that come from the CDC. 

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Why I think it's time to defund the CDC and abolish it

The CDC is giving us a glimpse of what it would do if it had more power and control over our domestic lives.  

In shutting down and locking out the cruise industry the CDC has gone from a science based health research and knowledge agency to a federal police force.  

The United States of America is too big for a one size fits all approach.  Each State should have the power to develop a response to any emergency for that State alone.  No State or conglomerate of states should have the power to effect control over any other single or multiple States.  Yet that is what the CDC has grown into.

The CDC should be a source of information that each state can draw from to make informed decisions but the CDC should NOT have the power to exercise direct control.  That is a tremendous overstep of power and authority that needs to stop before the CDC attempts to grow that power and gain control over our daily lives to a far greater extent. 

If left unchecked the CDC will slowly grow more powerful to the point they can effectively lock us in our own homes "to protect us".  

Our States and our States alone should only have the power to make these choices using guidance to make informed decision.  No unelected federal authority should have this level of control.

#DefundTheCDC 

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31 minutes ago, jticarruthers said:

CDC isnt in charge of nursing homes ... its probably a good thing that the CDC isnt in charge of much ...

Maybe they should not be in charge of the Cruise industry either!  They can't shut down air travel, even when going to resorts in other countries, same level of risk.  They can't shut down Disney world, same level of risk.  They can't shut down Professional sports, same level of risk.

8 minutes ago, twangster said:

Why I think it's time to defund the CDC and abolish it

....     .....

#DefundTheCDC 

Yes #DefundTheCDC

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53 minutes ago, jticarruthers said:

CDC isnt in charge of nursing homes ... its probably a good thing that the CDC isnt in charge of much ... if they were i think we would have all spent the last twelve months loaded into bubble wrap pods, with integrated life support gear, fed intravenously, etc.

Which is why the CDC shouldn't have any power over the cruise industry. Nursing homes are health care facilities. CDC as a health-related agency would seemingly have some reason to have oversight.

Cruises are recreational activities. CDC is not a recreation-related agency and thus should have not authority.

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In other travel news. the CDC just released study saying that airlines should not fill middle seats because leaving the middle seat open reduces the chance of Covid spread. 

Do you think airlines will adhere to this guidance? I have flown American about 5 times since pandemic and they have filled middle seats. Not to mention the smaller planes with 2x2 or 1x2 seating where every seat is filled.

The airlines know and have seen a ramped up, pent up demand for air travel this summer and how well Vaccination has been going (minus the J&J fiasco the CDC and FDA ae in now which is a TOTALLY other matter of incompetence) and Delta has announced it will fill middle seats starting May 1. 

Do you think the airlines are going to listen to the CDC regarding middle seats and give up revenue for the summer? No! But they are not bound to the CDC and at their mercy the way cruise lines are. 

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1 hour ago, twangster said:

16 months into the pandemic and the CDC swiftly responds.

A sloth would approve.

The research quoted was discussing "unmasked individuals sitting in the middle seats" ... pretty sure its required that everyone on the plane be masked ... so how is that research relevant ??? Go CDC .... making themselves look dumber every day.

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1 hour ago, UNCFanatik said:

In other travel news. the CDC just released study saying that airlines should not fill middle seats because leaving the middle seat open reduces the chance of Covid spread. 

Do you think airlines will adhere to this guidance? I have flown American about 5 times since pandemic and they have filled middle seats. Not to mention the smaller planes with 2x2 or 1x2 seating where every seat is filled.

The airlines know and have seen a ramped up, pent up demand for air travel this summer and how well Vaccination has been going (minus the J&J fiasco the CDC and FDA ae in now which is a TOTALLY other matter of incompetence) and Delta has announced it will fill middle seats starting May 1. 

Do you think the airlines are going to listen to the CDC regarding middle seats and give up revenue for the summer? No! But they are not bound to the CDC and at their mercy the way cruise lines are. 

 

The CDC is still stuck a year behind the times.  Their study is a bunch of theoretical and computer models based on simulations and mock ups not consistent with an actual airplane. Even their conclusions are a bunch of "maybes" and "coulds"

 

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7016e1.htm?s_cid=mm7016e1_w

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11 minutes ago, jticarruthers said:

The research quoted was discussing "unmasked individuals sitting in the middle seats" ... pretty sure its required that everyone on the plane be masked ... so how is that research relevant ??? Go CDC .... making themselves look dumber every day.

The basis for this study was done in 2017.

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22 minutes ago, smokeybandit said:

 

The CDC is still stuck a year behind the times.  Their study is a bunch of theoretical and computer models based on simulations and mock ups not consistent with an actual airplane. Even their conclusions are a bunch of "maybes" and "coulds"

 

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7016e1.htm?s_cid=mm7016e1_w

Agreed. But unfortunately, coulds, maybes, perhaps, possible are all terms that seem to dictate policy these days

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5 hours ago, smokeybandit said:

 

The CDC is still stuck a year behind the times.  Their study is a bunch of theoretical and computer models based on simulations and mock ups not consistent with an actual airplane. Even their conclusions are a bunch of "maybes" and "coulds"

 

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7016e1.htm?s_cid=mm7016e1_w

every time the CDC opens their mouth, it's yet another reminder of how epicly useless and irrelevant they are. 

they lost me when at the start of the pandemic they said "yeah we don't see a reason why anyone should need to wear a mask" which after some time turned into "hmmm you should probably wear a mask."  after that, they just became a faint, buzzing noise in the background.  

if it weren't for my love of cruising, I'd pay them less-than-zero attention.

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Its a waiting game.   If the only path forward becomes sailing from overseas ports, we'll have to live with it.   Not as profitable for cruise lines, more difficult for many, and won't be able to operate as many ships, but if done long enough will make the CDC  irrelevant.   Cruise lines should be able to squeak out surviving until the '22 election cycle and with the right adjustments, legislation to change this ridiculous jurisdiction might occur.

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Wasn't there a kids show that had a school on a cruise ship?  Since the priority seems to be opening schools right now, to the point of changing metrics to fit the current case/death/percentage positive counts, maybe all cruise ships should open up a little school onboard...

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14 hours ago, LCinPDX said:

Wasn't there a kids show that had a school on a cruise ship?  Since the priority seems to be opening schools right now, to the point of changing metrics to fit the current case/death/percentage positive counts, maybe all cruise ships should open up a little school onboard...

"The Suite Life of Zack and Cody" did indeed have a spinoff named "The Suite Life on Deck" where a group of kids living onboard thSS Tipton and attending classes at Seven Seas High.

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