Pier Damage in Sitka

[DDD]

Since one of the Royal ships damaged the pier in Sitka, any idea on how they'll handle it? It's one of my port stops in the very near future.

[smokeybandit]

https://www.kcaw.org/2022/05/12/damaged-mooring-dolphin-leaves-cruise-ship-terminal-at-half-capacity/

 

Looks like it'll require the 2nd ship that day to tender. 

 

I'm there June 7 on Serenade and Radiance (who did the damage) will be there too. I hope that means Radiance has to be the tender ship

[rbdavis3591]

2 hours ago, smokeybandit said:

https://www.kcaw.org/2022/05/12/damaged-mooring-dolphin-leaves-cruise-ship-terminal-at-half-capacity/

 

Looks like it'll require the 2nd ship that day to tender. 

 

I'm there June 7 on Serenade and Radiance (who did the damage) will be there too. I hope that means Radiance has to be the tender ship

The Ovation of the Seas was docked in port Sitka on May 17th but had to leave at 1 pm and anchor so that Celebrity Eclipse could dock. Ovation used their own boats to tender passengers until our departure.

[Vancity Cruiser]

At the top tier event on Radiance on the LA to Vancouver cruise the captian mentioned he had requested to be moved to a larger class ship with Royal. I don't think this incedent is going to help his cause to move to a larger ship lol

[smokeybandit]

20 minutes ago, Vancity Cruiser said:

At the top tier event on Radiance on the LA to Vancouver cruise the captian mentioned he had requested to be moved to a larger class ship with Royal. I don't think this incedent is going to help his cause to move to a larger ship lol

His new assignment may well be 

[bobroo]

Good news! No actual dolphins were harmed in this accident.

Bad news! What was the impact on our vessel, Radiance???

[smokeybandit]

3 hours ago, bobroo said:

Good news! No actual dolphins were harmed in this accident.

Bad news! What was the impact on our vessel, Radiance???

According to the article, no impact.

[Peter D]

Radiance canceled the Sitka stop on the May 20 sailing and going to Icy Straits instead.

[FrHoffard]

On 5/18/2022 at 7:59 AM, smokeybandit said:

His new assignment may well be 

Shouldn't impact the Captain.  All vessels have to have a Marine Pilot onboard that actually do the maneuvering of the ships in AK waters   

[Psycho and Barb]

On 5/25/2022 at 12:40 AM, FrHoffard said:

All vessels have to have a Marine Pilot onboard that actually do the maneuvering of the ships in AK waters   

We were told one time on a bridge tour that the Marine Pilot only advises and doesn't touch any of the ships controls...They don't have the ships specific skills to be trusted to maneuver the ship.  I'm also sure there must be some insurance liability issues.

[CruiseMom82]

I was there on May 20 on Serenade, didn't know there was any issue. We were the only ship at the dock, and people were tendering in from a Viking Ocean ship closer to town. Not sure if another ship would've docked after we left, which was about 2:30-3:00.

[RWDW1204]

Well now it looks like Harmony took out a pier/piling in Falmouth.

https://www.facebook.com/nick.vitani/videos/566621361470529

[smokeybandit]

I'm trying to figure out what she would have hit

 

[WAAAYTOOO]

One of the accounts I read said something about a "small private pier" or something similar.  I don't see it, either.

[smokeybandit]

While we're at it

 

 

[Matt]

3 hours ago, smokeybandit said:

I'm trying to figure out what she would have hit

Other end of the pier. It's those Mooring dolphins 

[smokeybandit]

15 minutes ago, Matt said:

Other end of the pier. It's those Mooring dolphins 

Yeah, that has to be it. But how does one back into those?  The ships usually back in away from the dock then pull in close with the thruster.

[smokeybandit]

Here's video of Harmony.

 

There's going to be some jobs on the line with this one as that's not an "oops" type mistake

 

 

[calvink669]

11 minutes ago, smokeybandit said:

Here's video of Harmony.

 

There's going to be some jobs on the line with this one as that's not an "oops" type mistake

 

 

Ugh, that didn't look good, we are scheduled to sail on Harmony on 6/12, I hope that didn't cause a tone of damage to the ship.

[FireFishII]

2 hours ago, calvink669 said:

Ugh, that didn't look good, we are scheduled to sail on Harmony on 6/12, I hope that didn't cause a tone of damage to the ship.

According to what I read,  cosmetic damage only. I don't think Canaveral can say the same. 

[smokeybandit]

25 minutes ago, FireFishII said:

According to what I read,  cosmetic damage only. I don't think Canaveral can say the same. 

It's probably not as bad as it looked, but still probably a few canceled cruises.

[WAAAYTOOO]

16 minutes ago, smokeybandit said:

It's probably not as bad as it looked, but still probably a few canceled cruises.

I dunno.  Flames shootin’ out the funnel looks pretty bad.  Wonder how long the backorder is on a whale tail…

[Moby Dick]

On 5/18/2022 at 7:36 AM, smokeybandit said:

https://www.kcaw.org/2022/05/12/damaged-mooring-dolphin-leaves-cruise-ship-terminal-at-half-capacity/

 

Looks like it'll require the 2nd ship that day to tender. 

 

I'm there June 7 on Serenade and Radiance (who did the damage) will be there too. I hope that means Radiance has to be the tender ship

Yep, just got off of the Ovation last week and our last Alaska Port of Call was Sitka.  What they did was tie up to the pier, allow anyone to come and go until about 1:00 PM and then pulled the ship out to the middle of the sound and anchored or stabilized its location using gps and thrusters. This was done to let a Celebrity Cruise ship dock.  After that, those that wanted to come and go had to tender.  We got off and on long before the 1:00 PM tender schedule.  Sitka is a beautiful and clean little town.  I'd like to go back one day.  

BTW, workers were working hard on the pier.  And the tenders were the ship's lifeboats!

[smokeybandit]

43 minutes ago, WAAAYTOOO said:

I dunno.  Flames shootin’ out the funnel looks pretty bad.  Wonder how long the backorder is on a whale tail…

Go steal one off the ships they just sent to the scrap yard

[rbdavis3591]

1 hour ago, 10-42 said:

Yep, just got off of the Ovation last week and our last Alaska Port of Call was Sitka.  What they did was tie up to the pier, allow anyone to come and go until about 1:00 PM and then pulled the ship out to the middle of the sound and anchored or stabilized its location using gps and thrusters. This was done to let a Celebrity Cruise ship dock.  After that, those that wanted to come and go had to tender.  We got off and on long before the 1:00 PM tender schedule.  Sitka is a beautiful and clean little town.  I'd like to go back one day.  

BTW, workers were working hard on the pier.  And the tenders were the ship's lifeboats!

Here was one of the Ovation's lifeboat tenders going back to Sitka and the empty lifeboat cradles.

For some reason the tenders kept going back to Sitka empty. 

[Moby Dick]

8 minutes ago, rbdavis3591 said:

Here was one of the Ovation's lifeboat tenders going back to Sitka and the empty lifeboat cradles.

For some reason the tenders kept going back to Sitka empty. 

WOW, I didn't notice that.  But, I was enjoying copious amounts of adult beverage at the Schooner Bar, et al.

I think I remember seeing you on the ship if that's you in your avatar.  

[FrHoffard]

15 hours ago, Psycho and Barb said:

We were told one time on a bridge tour that the Marine Pilot only advises and doesn't touch any of the ships controls...They don't have the ships specific skills to be trusted to maneuver the ship.  I'm also sure there must be some insurance liability issues.

Sorry, incorrect - at least for the pilot's in Alaska.  The pilot's have US Coast Guard Merchant Mariners credentials with a Master endorsement for unlimited tonnage for the specific region in Alaska where they work.  They complete a lengthy,  unpaid, training program and are trained on many vessels, they have mandatory maneuvers that must be completed on cruise ships in order to complete their training and become licensed by the State Board of Marine Pilot's.  I am the Marine Pilot Coordinator for the State of Alaska Board of Marine Pilot's and I issue their state licenses . The cruise ships aren't the only ones they are trained on, they complete about 2 years of training before being allowed at the controls of the vessels. 

[rbdavis3591]

11 hours ago, 10-42 said:

WOW, I didn't notice that.  But, I was enjoying copious amounts of adult beverage at the Schooner Bar, et al.

I think I remember seeing you on the ship if that's you in your avatar.  

Hard for me to miss since it was outside our stateroom.

For better or worse that is what I actually look like.

[twangster]

As it turns out I visited Sitka before and after the incident but didn't know it at the time.

The pier on approach from Serenade before the incident.

"Dolphins" are the name used for these outlying structures that are used to secure the lines from the ship.  The "dolphin" support prior to the incident.

On approach to the pier aboard Quantum on May 12.

The same "dolphin" pictured above after the incident.

Quantum docked normally that day and I didn't realize or notice the damage until I read about it later on in the cruise.  I did see in a FB post a couple days after that they had a crew working on the dolphin.  It's probably fixed already by this point.

[cruisellama]

14 hours ago, FireFishII said:

According to what I read,  cosmetic damage only. I don't think Canaveral can say the same. 

So will just buff out?

[twangster]

21 hours ago, Psycho and Barb said:

We were told one time on a bridge tour that the Marine Pilot only advises and doesn't touch any of the ships controls...They don't have the ships specific skills to be trusted to maneuver the ship.  I'm also sure there must be some insurance liability issues.

There is a difference between non US ports of call and US based ports.  In the Caribbean for example the pilots are there as advisors and do not take command of the ship.  In the US when maneuvering in a US port the Captain's I've heard talk about it describe the pilot's function as "the pilot takes a more active role".  Captains being the type A that they are don't like to admit they aren't in full command.  In some Caribbean ports the pilots role is almost ceremonial and an excuse to charge the ship fees.  It's very different in a US port. 

The Panama Canal is an example of another special circumstance.  There the local pilot does take command and control of the ship and Panama also places its own people on board to handle the lines.  It's a unique circumstance where they do have full insurance to cover the time they are in control of the ship.  Ship crew are still there and deal with any ship issues if something isn't working but the ship crew become assistants to the Panamanian handlers.

[Moby Dick]

27 minutes ago, cruisellama said:

So will just buff out?

Rub a little dirt on it.

[Vancity Cruiser]

7 hours ago, FrHoffard said:

I am the Marine Pilot Coordinator for the State of Alaska Board of Marine Pilot's and I issue their state licenses .

So this is all your fault then 

[smokeybandit]

8 hours ago, FrHoffard said:

I am the Marine Pilot Coordinator for the State of Alaska Board of Marine Pilot's and I issue their state licenses

FrHoffard giveth, FrHoffard taketh away too?

[FrHoffard]

9 hours ago, smokeybandit said:

FrHoffard giveth, FrHoffard taketh away too?

Not for this, nope lol

10 hours ago, Vancity Cruiser said:

So this is all your fault then 

Sure! Lol

[smokeybandit]

Repairs continue. I have pictures but sitka 4g sucks

[twangster]

As a follow up the NTSB has released its findings in the case of Radiance striking the mooring dolphin in Sitka.

https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/MIR2310.pdf

Probable Cause

The National Transportation Safety Board determines that the probable cause of the contact of the cruise ship Radiance of the Seas with the Sitka Sound Cruise Terminal pier was the master and bridge team’s overreliance on an electronic chart to identify the pier’s position relative to their planned rotation location, and the master’s misunderstanding of the clearance distances to the pier being called by the crewmember on the stern while the vessel was rotating. Contributing was the Sitka Sound Cruise Terminal not reporting the extension of the pier into the waterway to the appropriate hydrographic authority in order to update the relevant navigational chart.

The National Ocean and Atmospheric Administration’s (NOAA) Office of Coast Survey is the hydrographic authority responsible for maintaining and issuing corrections to all US coastal nautical charts. NOAA had no record of the construction completed on the Sitka Sound Cruise Terminal pier until after the casualty, when investigators informed them of the pier’s extension. NOAA staff told investigators that they would have updated the chart if they had been informed. They also stated that it is the responsibility of facility owners to inform them when permitted construction is complete and to provide drawings of the construction as built so that corrections and updates can be made to nautical charts for that area (neither the Sitka Sound Cruise Terminal’s permit nor regulations required this). The electronic navigation chart (ENC) did not show the extended pier and added dolphins until September 8, 2022, when NOAA updated the chart.4

 

[HeWhoWaits]

24 minutes ago, twangster said:

As a follow up the NTSB has released its findings in the case of Radiance striking the mooring dolphin in Sitka.

https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/MIR2310.pdf

Probable Cause

The National Transportation Safety Board determines that the probable cause of the contact of the cruise ship Radiance of the Seas with the Sitka Sound Cruise Terminal pier was the master and bridge team’s overreliance on an electronic chart to identify the pier’s position relative to their planned rotation location, and the master’s misunderstanding of the clearance distances to the pier being called by the crewmember on the stern while the vessel was rotating. Contributing was the Sitka Sound Cruise Terminal not reporting the extension of the pier into the waterway to the appropriate hydrographic authority in order to update the relevant navigational chart.

The National Ocean and Atmospheric Administration’s (NOAA) Office of Coast Survey is the hydrographic authority responsible for maintaining and issuing corrections to all US coastal nautical charts. NOAA had no record of the construction completed on the Sitka Sound Cruise Terminal pier until after the casualty, when investigators informed them of the pier’s extension. NOAA staff told investigators that they would have updated the chart if they had been informed. They also stated that it is the responsibility of facility owners to inform them when permitted construction is complete and to provide drawings of the construction as built so that corrections and updates can be made to nautical charts for that area (neither the Sitka Sound Cruise Terminal’s permit nor regulations required this). The electronic navigation chart (ENC) did not show the extended pier and added dolphins until September 8, 2022, when NOAA updated the chart.4

 

Based on the information shared above, the NTSB got the probable root cause and contributing factor reversed. Root cause is the one factor that if eliminated would have prevented (or at least greatly minimized the chance of) the occurrence. It appears that our governmental agencies don't understand the concept.

The most probable root cause was the failure to report the extension. Had THAT been correct, the reliance on electronic charts would (likely) not have created the contact.

[Matt]

[smokeybandit]

So the captain of that ship is probably related to this guy, since he relied solely on charts and not his own eyes.

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/gps-mistake-takes-driver-60-to-canada-border-where-he-is-arrested-with-drugs-and-600k-in-car/ar-AA1cg5wR