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Many of us who cruise go to the Caribbean. However, if the islands are closed it doesn't matter what RCCL decides to do. I decided to do some digging and it looks like many of them are trying to open things up starting on the 15th of this month. A few are waiting until July 1st. This is a good sign. Many of us are trying to stay optimistic about things, though I'm becoming more of a realist. Our ports of call being open is great! Now we need to see if they can start announcing the new policies and procedures for cruising again (whether we agree with them or not). We all have our views about them and I really hope that they can find a good medium. I'm also hoping that no more cruises are cancelled. We all need a vacation from the stress this has added to already stressful lives.

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1 hour ago, Matt said:

Agreed on all your points.

What I find confusing is some ports are open to travel, but other restrictions prohibit cruise ships.

I saw that too. I also saw where certain airports are opening and some aren't. French Sint Maarten is having troubles because they are being treated differently than France itself. Unfortunately all we can do is wait. I'm to the point that if they cancel I may rent a row boat! :4_joy:

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I truly feel that the Cruise Industry has taken one of the Hardest Hits of all Travel Industries and WHY? I really only know about Royal Caribbean first hand! I can truly say that their cruise ships are well-cared for and constantly being cleaned. It is a very organized cruise lines and takes much pride in keeping their fleets impeccable! Most areas of the travel industry are NOT as skilled in fighting any type of virus as a Cruise Line. Royal Caribbean has sanitation areas, large , well-equipped sinks, on entering their dining  areas and they make sure everyone uses these areas before entering to dine. The also have a catchy little hand-washing song played over their closed circuit TV in the staterooms and they really  teach and foster each passenger's responsibility to others during the sailing! There is always hand sanitizing stations available as well. The ENTIRE ship is sprayed down and sanitized between sailings. Also there is control during the sailings because the Ship is actually a city of the SAME PEOPLE during each cruise and everyone CAN BE screened before entering the ship and then there is NO ONE coming and going for the whole sailing! NO Hotel or Land Resort have these capabilities! People that call cruise ships Germ Incubators, have there nerve and meanwhile they Check into a Hotel Room that doesn't even have the capability to spray the entire hotel between guests, has guests coming and going every hour and many of these hotels just wash duvets...not the blanket inside...sleep well in your "Germ Incubator"!

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@Aslan It is all optics, those of us who cruise RCCI know its clean and responsible. However other lines are not so fastidious, CCL had hand washing as a suggestion and I rarely saw people cleaning the ship like RCCI workers. So when things hit the fan on Princess, it looks bad for all cruise lines. Plus there is a lot of possible transmissions involved with cruising because of ports. None of the lines can afford any more bad optics, so even the idea of a case of COVID would shut them down.

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3 hours ago, Aslan said:

I truly feel that the Cruise Industry has taken one of the Hardest Hits of all Travel Industries and WHY? I really only know about Royal Caribbean first hand! I can truly say that their cruise ships are well-cared for and constantly being cleaned. It is a very organized cruise lines and takes much pride in keeping their fleets impeccable! Most areas of the travel industry are NOT as skilled in fighting any type of virus as a Cruise Line. Royal Caribbean has sanitation areas, large , well-equipped sinks, on entering their dining  areas and they make sure everyone uses these areas before entering to dine. The also have a catchy little hand-washing song played over their closed circuit TV in the staterooms and they really  teach and foster each passenger's responsibility to others during the sailing! There is always hand sanitizing stations available as well. The ENTIRE ship is sprayed down and sanitized between sailings. Also there is control during the sailings because the Ship is actually a city of the SAME PEOPLE during each cruise and everyone CAN BE screened before entering the ship and then there is NO ONE coming and going for the whole sailing! NO Hotel or Land Resort have these capabilities! People that call cruise ships Germ Incubators, have there nerve and meanwhile they Check into a Hotel Room that doesn't even have the capability to spray the entire hotel between guests, has guests coming and going every hour and many of these hotels just wash duvets...not the blanket inside...sleep well in your "Germ Incubator"!

I've worked in hotels and so has my Dad. Most people DON'T want to know how unclean those places actually can be. Those who bad mouth cruise ships are usually the ones who have never been on one.

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2 hours ago, Ampurp85 said:

@Aslan It is all optics, those of us who cruise RCCI know its clean and responsible. However other lines are not so fastidious, CCL had hand washing as a suggestion and I rarely saw people cleaning the ship like RCCI workers. So when things hit the fan on Princess, it looks bad for all cruise lines. Plus there is a lot of possible transmissions involved with cruising because of ports. None of the lines can afford any more bad optics, so even the idea of a case of COVID would shut them down.

Unfortunately you are right. None of the cruise lines can afford to lose much more money either. Back when Carnival had those ships to break down, everyone knew it was just that line. This is different. It isn't something that they can control as much. All of this is so very frustrating for us all. Eventually, one of these companies is going to have to bite the bullet and be the first one to start sailing again. I hope when it does that there are NO new cases, but I doubt that would make the media.

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@Mrs. Thomas There is no way the US will have zero cases by the end of the year. Right now numbers are dipping but will surge again as more things open up. I read an article on HuffPo that stated over half of America feel like COVID is done, they wished it away or the numbers were lies. All these careless people are going to increase the numbers, look at Vegas; the workers are protecting themselves but people are like "meh its vacation/leisure." People want to get back to normal asap, all it take is one person to mess up on a cruise line. A hundred(s) sailing went on during the same time as the Princess ships, yet they focus on the 2 or 3 with COVID cases.....never mind the fact that millions of people caught COVID without even being near a cruise ship.

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6 minutes ago, Ampurp85 said:

@Mrs. Thomas There is no way the US will have zero cases by the end of the year. Right now numbers are dipping but will surge again as more things open up. I read an article on HuffPo that stated over half of America feel like COVID is done, they wished it away or the numbers were lies. All these careless people are going to increase the numbers, look at Vegas; the workers are protecting themselves but people are like "meh its vacation/leisure." People want to get back to normal asap, all it take is one person to mess up on a cruise line. A hundred(s) sailing went on during the same time as the Princess ships, yet they focus on the 2 or 3 with COVID cases.....never mind the fact that millions of people caught COVID without even being near a cruise ship.

Hi!  You mention these people as being careless.  The problem with this whole situation is that all of the data out there is dirty with no really good answer to support either argument.  The rules for certain gathering types and business and in which ways large numbers of people can gather make no sense.  I think this is why some people are not listening to government mandates as much as some would like.  I would not call it careless.

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1 hour ago, Mrs. Thomas said:

I've worked in hotels and so has my Dad. Most people DON'T want to know how unclean those places actually can be. Those who bad mouth cruise ships are usually the ones who have never been on one.

As someone who normally spends half the year in them I am always well aware of how hotels are “cleaned” and have learned to suspend my normal beliefs in order to stay sane. 

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@jaredhamburg I chose the word careless precisely for that reason. With all the mixed messages, we should rely on our internal moral compass and comprehension. Tons of people are being contrary or spiteful. But ultimately it boils down to choice: I have every right to choose what I want to believe, buy, do or see. My facts are simple: people need to wash their hands and not be up on me, businesses need to be clean... or I stay right where I am and pay you dust.

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Remind what US federal agency oversees a hotel on an Caribbean island?  What local health department oversees a hotel on an Caribbean island?

People will be able to fly to an island, spend a week in a hotel and fly back without restriction yet a cruise ship that is insanely clean and regulated by the CDC can't sail yet?

SMH

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14 hours ago, Ampurp85 said:

@Mrs. Thomas There is no way the US will have zero cases by the end of the year. Right now numbers are dipping but will surge again as more things open up. I read an article on HuffPo that stated over half of America feel like COVID is done, they wished it away or the numbers were lies. All these careless people are going to increase the numbers, look at Vegas; the workers are protecting themselves but people are like "meh its vacation/leisure." People want to get back to normal asap, all it take is one person to mess up on a cruise line. A hundred(s) sailing went on during the same time as the Princess ships, yet they focus on the 2 or 3 with COVID cases.....never mind the fact that millions of people caught COVID without even being near a cruise ship.

I don't believe that there will ever be zero cases. There are never zero cases of the flu. We may not hear of it as much, but that is because many people know what they have and don't go to the doctor for it. They deal with the symptoms until it's over and get on with life. It isn't like the flu says "well, it isn't flu season so I can't infect anyone yet." We hear about flu season because that is when it spikes. That also happens to be when we are all indoors more because of the weather. The flu shot is only about 20 - 40% effective. There are SO many ways to get life back going. The quarantine was supposed to be about keeping our health system from being overrun. Now it has become about no one getting sick. That is not feasible. I think that if the media stopped throwing it in our faces 24/7 everyone would realize that it isn't the bubonic plague.

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@Mrs. Thomas I don't think it WAS about not getting anyone sick, just curbing the infection rate given the circumstances.The main problem is the news cycle with political, fearmongering, and bias reporting; so it all optics. I cannot stress this enough but all the other pandemics in the history books were not over in mere months. From when it became an issue to now, has not been six months. Cases may have occurred as early as Dec but it wasn't until March that things progressed. I have never advocated continued shelter in place, jut restrictions. Should the CDC allow cruising asap, yes, but this early it needs to be at your own risk sort of thing. Caribbeans Islands rely on tourism, but they don't have the infrastructure to handle outbreaks. Just think about how ships of 1000s of pax each day might affect them....no wonder some ports haven't opened.

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14 hours ago, Ampurp85 said:

@jaredhamburg I chose the word careless precisely for that reason. With all the mixed messages, we should rely on our internal moral compass and comprehension. Tons of people are being contrary or spiteful. But ultimately it boils down to choice: I have every right to choose what I want to believe, buy, do or see. My facts are simple: people need to wash their hands and not be up on me, businesses need to be clean... or I stay right where I am and pay you dust.

In one part of your message, you mention people relying on their own internal capacities to determine what is right or wrong; but call people careless who apparently have come to a different opinion through their own internal capacities.  That is my issue.  It does boil down to choice, and talking down about people who disagree will not really get us anywhere.  It sounds like my opinions differ from yours as I am willing to weigh the risks and go out; but, I assure you, I and many others like me are not careless at all.

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1 hour ago, Ampurp85 said:

@Mrs. Thomas I don't think it WAS about not getting anyone sick, just curbing the infection rate given the circumstances.The main problem is the news cycle with political, fearmongering, and bias reporting; so it all optics. I cannot stress this enough but all the other pandemics in the history books were not over in mere months. From when it became an issue to now, has not been six months. Cases may have occurred as early as Dec but it wasn't until March that things progressed. I have never advocated continued shelter in place, jut restrictions. Should the CDC allow cruising asap, yes, but this early it needs to be at your own risk sort of thing. Caribbeans Islands rely on tourism, but they don't have the infrastructure to handle outbreaks. Just think about how ships of 1000s of pax each day might affect them....no wonder some ports haven't opened.

Unfortunately we are seeing the economic damage from all of this as well. There are multiple small businesses in my area that have had to close permanently. I don't understand how things in other countries are getting better but not in the US. However, the do have a much smaller population (most of them). I personally think that people need to be allowed to choose for themselves what they want to do. Yes, have some regulations like checking temps and hand washing (which people should be doing anyways), but let people decided to wear masks or not. Also, for those who feel it is too risky to sail, then by all means wait, but let the rest of us go. The stress of everything going on now is just too much for some of us and we need to get away. Stress kills too and at a much higher rate.

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@jaredhamburg Of course I am not talking about people who disagree with me. I hate mask but will wear them because I choose to do whatever activity; nobody is forcing me to book a cruise, visit Vegas or eat in a restaurant. People who refuse to wear mask but also chose to do activities that require them, are careless. That is plain courtesy and rule following. If it is a choice, fine....but people who go places where they know mask and safety precautions are mandated...but refuse or spit/cough/hurt people.....that's careless. I don't disagree with people who don't want to wear mask for pleasure, I disagree with people who won't follow the rules. Then bemoan businesses for not opening they way they want to, as in pre-COVID.

@Mrs. Thomas Businesses need rules to protect themselves. Some leisure activities may be able to get away with wear a mask at your own risk. But stores, businesses, restaurants, etc  can be sued. American is king when it comes to frivolous lawsuits.

******Also let me clarify that careless was pulled out of context. I stated it in conjunction with the article I read where people said COVID was over. People who believe that COVID has disappeared are careless. I then went on to specify Vegas as an example. There are videos up of people saying its over, as they party by the pool.

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55 minutes ago, Ampurp85 said:

 

@Mrs. Thomas Businesses need rules to protect themselves. Some leisure activities may be able to get away with wear a mask at your own risk. But stores, businesses, restaurants, etc  can be sued. American is king when it comes to frivolous lawsuits.

Yes, unfortunately people have become "sue happy" in America. I believe that if a company wants to make them mandatory then that is their freedom as a company. Then we as consumers can choose what we wish to do based on the rules. If a person doesn't plan on obeying the rules, then they should wait until the rules change to their liking before cruising or whatever.

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On 6/12/2020 at 3:53 PM, Ampurp85 said:

******Also let me clarify that careless was pulled out of context. I stated it in conjunction with the article I read where people said COVID was over. People who believe that COVID has disappeared are careless. 

Just because you don't agree with someone does't give you the right to shame them into your beliefs! I find that Just as offensive, which you're doing by calling them careless.

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On 6/13/2020 at 12:40 AM, Mrs. Thomas said:

Unfortunately we are seeing the economic damage from all of this as well. There are multiple small businesses in my area that have had to close permanently. I don't understand how things in other countries are getting better but not in the US. However, the do have a much smaller population (most of them). I personally think that people need to be allowed to choose for themselves what they want to do. Yes, have some regulations like checking temps and hand washing (which people should be doing anyways), but let people decided to wear masks or not. Also, for those who feel it is too risky to sail, then by all means wait, but let the rest of us go. The stress of everything going on now is just too much for some of us and we need to get away. Stress kills too and at a much higher rate.

You say the large population is a reason for things not getting better? That may be an excuse for things being bigger at their peak but no excuse for not turning things around. New York have at least turned the corner with a large and dense population. What is the excuse for places like Arizona? I am all for going cruising again and making our own choices, but our choice doesnt just affect us. 

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Back to the main topic, to start up again in the Caribbean, perhaps cruise lines could begin by just offering shorter cruises and featuring mainly their private islands.  That way all of the discussions about government permission would not be as crucial. There would also be no exposure to people other than those already pre-screened by the ship. My RC cruise that was cancelled this April featured a day at CocoCay, and I was really looking forward to visiting and seeing all the updates from my last visit.  I also have heard that there are recommendations that cruise lines improve their medical facilities and create more comprehensive plans on how to deal with medical emergencies, which I believe are valid actions to take.  I am quite interested in cruising again, but I would not really look forward to wearing a mask around all day.  Let's hope a potential vaccine is developed soon!

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