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San Juan getting a new pier and cruise terminal


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Be interested in seeing some specific plans. 

We have been disappointed in the inconsistency of ships Royal has been sailing from San Juan.

Last time there in Jan of 2022 we were changed from original Freedom booking to Explorer (close to same).  We are having to skip Jan-Feb 2023 and Voyager would not be to bad.  But 2024 Jewel just doesn't cut it for us.  In 2020 just before Covid they also did a ship change down grading us to Jewel.

San Juan is a wonderful embarkation port, just sometimes the choice of ship seams to leave a little to be desired for me.  JMHO

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I am glad to see that San Juan is going forward with their plan, it has been overdue and a long time coming. 

 

On the other hand, modifications to the ports in San Juan bring nothing but bad memories on how ugly and intimidating the top management of Royal Caribbean can be. 

 

The more successful San Juan's port modifications become, the bigger the middle finger in the face of the  bullies of Royal Caribbean. Good for you San Juan! keep up the good work!

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15 minutes ago, bobroo said:

On the other hand, modifications to the ports in San Juan bring nothing but bad memories on how ugly and intimidating the top management of Royal Caribbean can be. 

 

The more successful San Juan's port modifications become, the bigger the middle finger in the face of the  bullies of Royal Caribbean. Good for you San Juan! keep up the good work!

I have no idea what this means

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21 minutes ago, bobroo said:

I am glad to see that San Juan is going forward with their plan, it has been overdue and a long time coming. 

 

On the other hand, modifications to the ports in San Juan bring nothing but bad memories on how ugly and intimidating the top management of Royal Caribbean can be. 

 

The more successful San Juan's port modifications become, the bigger the middle finger in the face of the  bullies of Royal Caribbean. Good for you San Juan! keep up the good work!

Can to share with the rest of the class what you are talking about?

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52 minutes ago, bobroo said:

I am glad to see that San Juan is going forward with their plan, it has been overdue and a long time coming. 

 

On the other hand, modifications to the ports in San Juan bring nothing but bad memories on how ugly and intimidating the top management of Royal Caribbean can be. 

 

The more successful San Juan's port modifications become, the bigger the middle finger in the face of the  bullies of Royal Caribbean. Good for you San Juan! keep up the good work!

Confused Joe Biden GIF by CBS News

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I know in the times before COVID seems like 30 years ago but in about December/January-ish of 2019 Puerto Rico wanted to remodel their cruise ports. Royal Caribbean was excluded from the conversation and this really got their underwear in a bunch. There is (or perhaps was) a Royal business unit that is a port and pier general contractor/designer/consultant/architect. And not that they don't know the business or do a good job; but it does bring in "their guys". I think it was the "their guys" that Puerto Rico found objectionable and therefore said 'No, we are doing the job ourselves'.

Well, Royal got really upset they were not the architect/general contractor. They stomped their feet and threw their weight around.  There were a bunch of threatening letters to top politicians and I believe some top brass from Royal had meetings with these politicians to change their minds(?) stating that Royal had had a close relationship with PR for 40 years and the good things they do but real heavy on the PR owed Royal the job of port improvements.

PR said, we are doing the job without you. And about that 2019 December/January-ish timeframe Royal Caribbean cancelled any future ports of call to San Juan that they had not already had under contract with their port authority. There were some source documents posted on the Blog at the time (letters penned by Royal). And there was a press release stating the future cessation of sailing to San Juan which was really brash and totally uncharacteristic of Royal. You could tell they were steaming.

It all was just 3 years ago.

 

Post COVID we have sailings to San Juan way into the future. I wonder if the revenue from the just-about-a-guarantee of selling a few hundred cabins to the quinceanera girls on any sailing out of San Juan changed their mind?

 

 

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2 hours ago, bobroo said:

I know in the times before COVID seems like 30 years ago but in about December/January-ish of 2019 Puerto Rico wanted to remodel their cruise ports. Royal Caribbean was excluded from the conversation and this really got their underwear in a bunch. There is (or perhaps was) a Royal business unit that is a port and pier general contractor/designer/consultant/architect. And not that they don't know the business or do a good job; but it does bring in "their guys". I think it was the "their guys" that Puerto Rico found objectionable and therefore said 'No, we are doing the job ourselves'.

Well, Royal got really upset they were not the architect/general contractor. They stomped their feet and threw their weight around.  There were a bunch of threatening letters to top politicians and I believe some top brass from Royal had meetings with these politicians to change their minds(?) stating that Royal had had a close relationship with PR for 40 years and the good things they do but real heavy on the PR owed Royal the job of port improvements.

PR said, we are doing the job without you. And about that 2019 December/January-ish timeframe Royal Caribbean cancelled any future ports of call to San Juan that they had not already had under contract with their port authority. There were some source documents posted on the Blog at the time (letters penned by Royal). And there was a press release stating the future cessation of sailing to San Juan which was really brash and totally uncharacteristic of Royal. You could tell they were steaming.

It all was just 3 years ago.

 

Post COVID we have sailings to San Juan way into the future. I wonder if the revenue from the just-about-a-guarantee of selling a few hundred cabins to the quinceanera girls on any sailing out of San Juan changed their mind?

 

 

 

2 hours ago, fireclan said:

Maybe it has something to do with reports 3-4 years ago of privatization (is that really a word?) of the port? I vaguely remember RC possibly saying they would pull out of San Juan. 

It wasn’t just Royal Caribbean, all the lines had the same reaction to the government of Puerto Rico taking over the pier and cruise terminal operations.

The local government had proven time and time again that they could not manage these operations properly due to their financial constraints. The dis repair of the current infrastructure and lack of reliability on operations had become a significant obstacle to profitable operations for the cruise lines. The cruise lines wanted to have a say in how things were built and operated because their success in the area was tied to the proper execution of the plan. 
 

Enter Global Holdings Int. They manage these projects all over the region, and the world. They have relationships with all the players AND deep pockets. 

 

This is not a middle finger in the face of Royal Caribbean, just the opposite. 

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I like it when RCL flexes it's muscles. I wish they would do it more to the COVID restricted Islands that keep me testing and wearing masks.

RCL seems pretty well managed to me. 26 ships, withstanding over a billion dollars in losses with COVID no sailings, while providing an incredible product (and I get 4 free drinks a day). 

P.S. I own no RCL stock, I have no relatives working for or invested in RCL. I just like them in general.

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@bobroo I found an article from 2019 that went into a little more detail about this disagreement between San Juan and several cruise lines.  In the article it is reported that Carnival Cruise Line in addition to Royal Caribbean had grown increasingly frustrated with the conditions/infrastructure of the docks, the Port Authority in San Juan had not invested any money in the docks and their financial situation at the time in 2019 didn't allow them to invest in money in upgrading their docks.  It was reported that Puerto Rico back then was looking at privatizing the cruise docks although the article does not divulge which company they were looking at.  However it is reported in the article both Royal Caribbean and Carnival asked the local government to stop the sell or privatization because both cruise lines were willing to invest their own money into repairing the docks.  (I'm assuming if both Carnival and Royal wanted to repair the docks they would have also taken the time in upgrade the docks to handle larger ships.)  Their offer was rejected at which point Royal decided they would pull out of San Juan.

However now in 2022 San Juan signs a deal with Global Ports Holding this company manages ports around the world just look at what they doing at Nassau's port. I think this is a deal both Royal and Carnival can get behind.  I think the whole reason behinds Royals frustration was do to the fact that the Port Authority had allowed the port and docks in San Juan to fall into such disrepair and they didn't have money to fix it and who knows how long talks or negotiations had been going on.  At a certain point Royal and Carnival was like we will pay to get this fixed (probably because it was impacting their customers experience) and that offer was turned down Royal decided to pull its ships. Luckily for all everything worked out Royal is still sailing from San Juan and the contract to privatize was awarded to Global Ports Holding.

https://www.theweeklyjournal.com/business/royal-caribbean-cruise-ships-canceling-calls-to-san-juan/article_adf16aa2-1084-11ea-9748-b31d04b39438.html

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 8/17/2022 at 10:27 AM, bobroo said:

I know in the times before COVID seems like 30 years ago but in about December/January-ish of 2019 Puerto Rico wanted to remodel their cruise ports. Royal Caribbean was excluded from the conversation and this really got their underwear in a bunch. There is (or perhaps was) a Royal business unit that is a port and pier general contractor/designer/consultant/architect. And not that they don't know the business or do a good job; but it does bring in "their guys". I think it was the "their guys" that Puerto Rico found objectionable and therefore said 'No, we are doing the job ourselves'.

Well, Royal got really upset they were not the architect/general contractor. They stomped their feet and threw their weight around.  There were a bunch of threatening letters to top politicians and I believe some top brass from Royal had meetings with these politicians to change their minds(?) stating that Royal had had a close relationship with PR for 40 years and the good things they do but real heavy on the PR owed Royal the job of port improvements.

PR said, we are doing the job without you. And about that 2019 December/January-ish timeframe Royal Caribbean cancelled any future ports of call to San Juan that they had not already had under contract with their port authority. There were some source documents posted on the Blog at the time (letters penned by Royal). And there was a press release stating the future cessation of sailing to San Juan which was really brash and totally uncharacteristic of Royal. You could tell they were steaming.

It all was just 3 years ago.

 

Post COVID we have sailings to San Juan way into the future. I wonder if the revenue from the just-about-a-guarantee of selling a few hundred cabins to the quinceanera girls on any sailing out of San Juan changed their mind?

 

 

I remember this story. Was a big thing and the COVID happened. Totally forgot about it until you brought it up.

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