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Vaccine optimism....maybe.....if youre into that kind of thing


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1 hour ago, RCIfan1912 said:

Then there is this company I have been following closely. Sounds very interesting to me but I am not a doc. Maybe it make more sense to some of you.

 

https://investors.sorrentotherapeutics.com/news-releases/news-release-details/sorrento-announces-selection-t-viva-19tm-targeted-protein

 

RCIfan,

Always good to hear of promising outcomes from potential SARS-CoV2 vaccines.  But realize that the link above reports results from a study done in mice.  So this is still in pre-clinical stage and must be approved for human subject studies.  Even with approval, the first human studies will primarily evaluate safety/side effects rather than efficacy.  The Pfizer study linked on your previous post looks to be a Phase 1 human study.  The promising news is that vaccination induced antibody levels higher than that seen is a typical infected individual.  The potential bad news is that at the higher doses, the vaccine exhibited some side effects and in one case (in my quick read), serious enough to cause cessation of that arm of the study.  Any positive outcomes in the early stage studies is reason to be optimistic, but there is a long way to go for testing the various vaccine candidates.  It is said that later this summer we will see results of the Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine results which from what I understand is currently being evaluated to determine if if can actually reduce SARS-CoV2 infection.  A positive result there would be very good.

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On 6/25/2020 at 3:10 PM, RCIfan1912 said:

As long as it is deemed by federal agencies and I hear from private industry that is producing this vaccine that it went through very thorough and rigorous testing I will get it especially if it gives me peace of mind and can cruise. 

But what kind of piece of mind is 50% effective? You’ve got a 50/50 shot at being protected. That’s IF you produce antibodies to the vaccine. 

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32 minutes ago, Jill said:

But what kind of piece of mind is 50% effective? You’ve got a 50/50 shot at being protected. That’s IF you produce antibodies to the vaccine. 

Its not set in stone that it will only be 50% effective. Right now I have 0% effective vaccine so 50% is still better. I think in the end it will be higher than 50%. 

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12 hours ago, Jill said:

I read today that it’s estimated only 50% will take the vaccine. Anyone know off hand the flu A/B percentage? 

According to the CDC it can be anywhere from 19% to 53% effective.

@jaredhamburg I agree. There is no way that they could have done enough tests and such in this small amount of time. You can't even get an allergy medicine without risking crazy side effects, even if the risk is slight. The reason that people are acting different now as opposed to when it was H1N1 is due to the media coverage.

On ‎6‎/‎25‎/‎2020 at 3:10 PM, RCIfan1912 said:

As long as it is deemed by federal agencies and I hear from private industry that is producing this vaccine that it went through very thorough and rigorous testing I will get it especially if it gives me peace of mind and can cruise. 

You are much more trusting then I am of people. I've seen too many lies to believe what they have to say at this point. They have too long of a track record of lying to the public.

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8 minutes ago, Mrs. Thomas said:

According to the CDC it can be anywhere from 19% to 53% effective.

@jaredhamburg I agree. There is no way that they could have done enough tests and such in this small amount of time. You can't even get an allergy medicine without risking crazy side effects, even if the risk is slight. The reason that people are acting different now as opposed to when it was H1N1 is due to the media coverage.

You are much more trusting then I am of people. I've seen too many lies to believe what they have to say at this point. They have too long of a track record of lying to the public.

They who? Who are we talking about lying to people?

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2 hours ago, Mrs. Thomas said:

. The reason that people are acting different now as opposed to when it was H1N1 is due to the media coverage.

 

I respectfully disagree. H1N1 was nothing like this. Ask any doctor, nurse, or respiratory therapist. in any hospital who is treating Covid-19 patients.  

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The only constants in this thing is that with every person, there is a differing opinion with everyone else. With every trusted (I don't trust any of them) news source saying one thing, there is another saying something different. The government is more interested in covering it's back side while it tries look like it's acting in the public interest. With every person who wants a vaccine, there is another who doesn't. To me, it boils down to "authorities" who keep changing the story trying to micromanage the outcome instead of letting the miracle of human biology take care of the issue. Living a healthy lifestyle is excoriated amidst a preference for pharmaceuticals and fast food. So, to me, again, it comes to this...if there is someone who takes assurance in the vaccine they have taken, why would they be worried about someone who hasn't? From the beginning, I have been more worried about the response than the virus itself.

I recall the scare videos from China late last Fall, and images of people in Wuhan who were yelling from their locked down apartments that it was all fake (at least that was what was translated in the videos I saw), and the images of people in hazmat suits fogging the streets with some virus killing fog.

So, my conclusion mirrors what Keanu Reeves said about the movie, The Matrix. He said it was a documentary.

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4 hours ago, SpeedNoodles said:

I respectfully disagree. H1N1 was nothing like this. Ask any doctor, nurse, or respiratory therapist. in any hospital who is treating Covid-19 patients.  

I'm not saying the virus is the same because it isn't. However, the average Joe freaking out is because of the deluge of negative information being thrown at us on a regular basis. Also, H1N1 was stopped earlier because the world had known about it longer. Things were different then. A treatment was found sooner, but the media also wasn't giving numbers every 5 minutes like now. The local hospitals aren't full and the numbers show that deaths are down even though cases are up, which I believe is due to more tests being done and positives given by people who had it but no longer do. Personally, I'm tired of hearing about it, or at least all the negatives. Why can't they give the number of those who have recovered already which is over 50% and pushing 60%+ in some places. 

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6 hours ago, RCIfan1912 said:

They who? Who are we talking about lying to people?

You said "As long as it is deemed by federal agencies and I hear from private industry that is producing this vaccine that it went through very thorough and rigorous testing I will get it especially if it gives me peace of mind and can cruise." in your other post. Those are the ones that I don't trust as a whole. There may be specific people that are telling the truth, but I'm very skeptical of most in power anymore. I don't care what side of the political isle they are on.

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16 minutes ago, Mrs. Thomas said:

You said "As long as it is deemed by federal agencies and I hear from private industry that is producing this vaccine that it went through very thorough and rigorous testing I will get it especially if it gives me peace of mind and can cruise." in your other post. Those are the ones that I don't trust as a whole. There may be specific people that are telling the truth, but I'm very skeptical of most in power anymore. I don't care what side of the political isle they are on.

Then who would you trust? That basically means you wouldn't trust anyone on this issue. 

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6 hours ago, Mrs. Thomas said:

I'm not saying the virus is the same because it isn't. However, the average Joe freaking out is because of the deluge of negative information being thrown at us on a regular basis. Also, H1N1 was stopped earlier because the world had known about it longer. Things were different then. A treatment was found sooner, but the media also wasn't giving numbers every 5 minutes like now. The local hospitals aren't full and the numbers show that deaths are down even though cases are up, which I believe is due to more tests being done and positives given by people who had it but no longer do. Personally, I'm tired of hearing about it, or at least all the negatives. Why can't they give the number of those who have recovered already which is over 50% and pushing 60%+ in some places. 

Deaths are down from the peak but are hardly going down. Most countries who have this under some control have both numbers going way down. 

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Hospitalizations are up, people need to take this serious to get through it. From what I can see and read the idea that this is just going to go away isn´t reality. It also seems a far greater number of medical professionals and scientists are in that same mind set. Just trying to ignore it doesn´t seem to be the right path forward.  

14 hours ago, bretts173 said:
20 hours ago, Mrs. Thomas said:

Personally, I'm tired of hearing about it, or at least all the negatives. Why can't they give the number of those who have recovered already which is over 50% and pushing 60%+ in some places. 

 

 

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On ‎7‎/‎3‎/‎2020 at 11:52 AM, ehw51 said:

Hospitalizations are up, people need to take this serious to get through it. From what I can see and read the idea that this is just going to go away isn´t reality. It also seems a far greater number of medical professionals and scientists are in that same mind set. Just trying to ignore it doesn´t seem to be the right path forward.  

 

How about some demographics for those people in the hospital? The mainstream media doesn't tell us how many of those people have underlying conditions that cause ANY sickness to be a big deal. According to the statistics that I found the is percentage is at least 90%. Also, when you have governors purposely putting sick people into nursing homes, that number is going to go way up. I agree that this sickness will never go away. It is the new flu in the idea that there will always be someone who has it at some point. People get the flu all the time, even if they get a vaccine. I'm not saying ignore it. I'm saying that people are acting like this is the black death and it isn't. Politicians are trying to use it to control people. People are easy to control when they are afraid.

@RCIfan1912 No, I really trust politicians or greedy pharmaceutical companies. I also know the rigors of what it takes to make a trusted vaccine and making it in only a few months doesn't cut it for me. However, I also believe in the human body. It was created to learn how to fight off most sicknesses. If you are relatively healthy, then according to what we have seen, you should have no problem getting over having COVID. I know multiple people, myself and children included, that had it and kicked it within one or two weeks (it differed for each person). My biggest issue with the vaccine is that it is rushed. People should NOT be taking or even being part of trials yet until the scientists have had a lot more time. It took decades to perfect the flu vaccine. 

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7 minutes ago, Mrs. Thomas said:

How about some demographics for those people in the hospital? The mainstream media doesn't tell us how many of those people have underlying conditions that cause ANY sickness to be a big deal. According to the statistics that I found the is percentage is at least 90%. Also, when you have governors purposely putting sick people into nursing homes, that number is going to go way up. I agree that this sickness will never go away. It is the new flu in the idea that there will always be someone who has it at some point. People get the flu all the time, even if they get a vaccine. I'm not saying ignore it. I'm saying that people are acting like this is the black death and it isn't. Politicians are trying to use it to control people. People are easy to control when they are afraid.

@RCIfan1912 No, I really trust politicians or greedy pharmaceutical companies. I also know the rigors of what it takes to make a trusted vaccine and making it in only a few months doesn't cut it for me. However, I also believe in the human body. It was created to learn how to fight off most sicknesses. If you are relatively healthy, then according to what we have seen, you should have no problem getting over having COVID. I know multiple people, myself and children included, that had it and kicked it within one or two weeks (it differed for each person). My biggest issue with the vaccine is that it is rushed. People should NOT be taking or even being part of trials yet until the scientists have had a lot more time. It took decades to perfect the flu vaccine. 

You think that governors "purposely" hurt people in nursing homes? 

You think scientists and pharma companies are going to rush something that will hurt or kill people? 

The distrust of everything is the downfall of society. It's distrust of every single institution the country has. Yet we have people that believe a maniac you talks about "very powerful light" and "disinfectants" as a treatment. We are living in an upside down world. 

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5 minutes ago, RCIfan1912 said:

You think that governors "purposely" hurt people in nursing homes? 

You think scientists and pharma companies are going to rush something that will hurt or kill people? 

The distrust of everything is the downfall of society. It's distrust of every single institution the country has. Yet we have people that believe a maniac you talks about "very powerful light" and "disinfectants" as a treatment. We are living in an upside down world. 

I believe that a certain governor, knowing that people in nursing homes were and are the most at risk, put people testing positive into nursing homes as a "quarantine". This resulted in many of them getting sick, dying, and one (that we know of) being abused by one of those quarantined people. No, I don't think scientists will rush into anything. They will do as they are told. I believe that pharma companies, politicians, media, and the panicked public will push those scientists to rush into something that could potentially harm people. When a cancer patient has to pay $25,000 for ONE treatment and a meth head gets their "treatments" for free, there is a greed problem with pharma companies. Yes, there is a special treatment that uses UV light on surfaces and was being looked at for use internally as well. (See article in the Washington Post) However, I don't just blindly trust people. I look at all aspects of things. Ask yourself this, how is it that we can't find a cure for cancer, diabetes, or even a flu vaccine that works 60% or more of the time, and yet they want to have a vaccine for this within a few months of even knowing what this is? If they can, then maybe it really has been around ALOT longer than just 4 months or so.

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1 minute ago, Mrs. Thomas said:

I believe that a certain governor, knowing that people in nursing homes were and are the most at risk, put people testing positive into nursing homes as a "quarantine". This resulted in many of them getting sick, dying, and one (that we know of) being abused by one of those quarantined people. No, I don't think scientists will rush into anything. They will do as they are told. I believe that pharma companies, politicians, media, and the panicked public will push those scientists to rush into something that could potentially harm people. When a cancer patient has to pay $25,000 for ONE treatment and a meth head gets their "treatments" for free, there is a greed problem with pharma companies. Yes, there is a special treatment that uses UV light on surfaces and was being looked at for use internally as well. (See article in the Washington Post) However, I don't just blindly trust people. I look at all aspects of things. Ask yourself this, how is it that we can't find a cure for cancer, diabetes, or even a flu vaccine that works 60% or more of the time, and yet they want to have a vaccine for this within a few months of even knowing what this is? If they can, then maybe it really has been around ALOT longer than just 4 months or so.

There is too much here to even get into. Good lord. 

You used the word "purposely" which means they deliberately hurt or killed people.

Are you really comparing a respiratory virus with something as complicated as cancer which comes in a million different forms? 

Scientists will not put people at risk, the public has no mechanism to force or pressure companies into giving people an incomplete vaccine. 

Yeah I know about the UV light but it's as far fetched at the moment as going to Mars. Disinfectants though sounds doable in the near future. ? 

Distrust of every institution is the downfall of this country and society as a whole. There are agencies that are there to make sure a vaccine does not harm people. I get the flu shot with no issues. No reason to think this won't be any different at this point. 

 

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38 minutes ago, RCIfan1912 said:

 I get the flu shot with no issues. No reason to think this won't be any different at this point. 

 

Good for you. Glad you don't. However, for a long time people with egg allergies had problems. Every time my husband has gotten the flu vaccine (yes more than once) it caused him to develop pneumonia. After DECADES of development and usage the flu vaccine is only effective from 19% to 53% of the time, per the CDC website. I don't distrust EVERY institution, just those with a history of being a bit shady in their practices. Also, you can't deny that pharma companies are FOR PROFIT companies. If they weren't the prices of things like insulin, epileptic meds, or epi-pens wouldn't be so expensive that people either cut down on their dosage (which is dangerous) or can't buy it at all. However, this is a new VACCINE and not a tried and tested drug. I know for a fact that some are already trying human testing. It is too early for that. Human trials should never be done in only knowing about a virus for 3 or 4 months. It just isn't safe! I'm not saying that a safe vaccine can't or won't be developed. I just don't think there has been enough information about how the virus acts in humans to make a safe one yet. We are getting new information all the time about how this virus effects different people, especially people with underlying conditions. While it may be ok for me, who is relatively healthy, my dad who has other issues, or my kids who are still developing, may have major reactions to it. It is just too early for people to be lining up for this thing.

As far as the governor, YES he knowingly put sick people into nursing homes. He didn't do it by accident, so yes it was on purpose. What the heck did he think was going to happen?! If he didn't do it to make them sick, then he was negligent and just didn't care if our most vulnerable in those places got sick and died.

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4 minutes ago, Mrs. Thomas said:

Good for you. Glad you don't. However, for a long time people with egg allergies had problems. Every time my husband has gotten the flu vaccine (yes more than once) it caused him to develop pneumonia. After DECADES of development and usage the flu vaccine is only effective from 19% to 53% of the time, per the CDC website. I don't distrust EVERY institution, just those with a history of being a bit shady in their practices. Also, you can't deny that pharma companies are FOR PROFIT companies. If they weren't the prices of things like insulin, epileptic meds, or epi-pens wouldn't be so expensive that people either cut down on their dosage (which is dangerous) or can't buy it at all. However, this is a new VACCINE and not a tried and tested drug. I know for a fact that some are already trying human testing. It is too early for that. Human trials should never be done in only knowing about a virus for 3 or 4 months. It just isn't safe! I'm not saying that a safe vaccine can't or won't be developed. I just don't think there has been enough information about how the virus acts in humans to make a safe one yet. We are getting new information all the time about how this virus effects different people, especially people with underlying conditions. While it may be ok for me, who is relatively healthy, my dad who has other issues, or my kids who are still developing, may have major reactions to it. It is just too early for people to be lining up for this thing.

As far as the governor, YES he knowingly put sick people into nursing homes. He didn't do it by accident, so yes it was on purpose. What the heck did he think was going to happen?! If he didn't do it to make them sick, then he was negligent and just didn't care if our most vulnerable in those places got sick and died.

I got the flu really, really bad a few years ago, I missed 6 days off work, I will never ever go without the flu shot again. If it's only 50% then it's 50%, better than 0%. I will get the flu shot going forward. 

Of course pharma companies are greedy, what American capitalist company isn't? Does big pharma annoy me/piss me off with the prices they charge for some drugs, hell yes. That is a whole discussion about government and private health care that is never ending. 

As for my state of NJ, I'm proud of how we responded and got this thing down to a manageable level. Did our Governor make mistakes, hell yes. No one is perfect, but do I think for a second he did anything that purposely hurt people, um no. People make mistakes. 

Do I want things open ASAP, again hell yes but guess what it doesn't work like that. We did go to the mall this yesterday, a different experience definitely. Some rules make sense, some don't, some are a bit hard to follow but I believe people have health and safety at heart. 

I guess in the end I'm not as jaded as most. I lose trust when it's necessary not because it's the thing to do as it is now. 

 

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I do not hold much hope for a vaccine ..this virus has mutated so many times already the chance a vaccine will be effective is small due to the prolonged testing times before it is manufactured....it will be a stronger version of itself by then....I am all for vaccines when they are effective but it seems many people think this thing is like flu... it in not it attacks the immune system and therefore injures organs in the process...please learn to protect yourselves and your families by distancing and wearing masks and also WASHY WASHY

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