LifesEz

Can someone confirm this?

Just had a gentleman on my Aug 21st FB Group receive an email canceling his B2B (Aug 14th & 21st) because our 21st cruise is going to St Maartens. Apparently, St Maartens is not allowing cruise ships with passengers who have been in certain countries 14 or fewer days before arriving. If true, why isn't Royal canceling St Maartens?
2 countries of interest on the restriction list are The Bahamas & Honduras.

Crazy.
Aug 21st cruise goes to Nassau, Bahamas on Aug 22nd, then St Maartens Aug 25th.
Can someone explain that one to me?

Coco Cay is in the Bahamas! Symphony Aug 29th goes to Coco Cay.
The Sept 4th Cruise goes to Roatan, Honduras Sep 7th and Coco Cay Sept 10th. 
The Sept 11th goes to St Maartens Sep 14th, then to Coco Cay in the Bahamas.
Sounds like our B4B might end up as a B3B. 
They will lose all B2B and B3Bs on Aug 29th & Sept 4th, Sept 11th, as well as Sept 18th that is a dupicate of the Sept 11 cruise and goes to St Maartens, after Coco Cay on Sept 17th.
⁠
I hope they pay for the change in my Air2Sea flight home.
They cancelled many of our ports due to various restrictions. 

28 minutes ago, LovetoCruise87 said:

We were able to check in for our Aug 22 Allure sailing 32 days before. 

Our Symphony, Aug 21st, opened about July 16, 36 days before the cruise.

9 hours ago, jticarruthers said:

No moving while eating/drinking, we got nailed on turning away from the soda machine and drinking while walking away. 

Stand still while you eat/drink or mask up and walk seemed to be the rule.

Does it say that in the CDC?

I know former Sec of HHS Mike Leavitt personally. Next time I see him, I will ask him if the HSP or CDC require I stand still.

Also, what about during entertainment. If they are providing drinks, I don't have to put a lollipop down.

I've been thinking about the exception for a while. All my life, I have been a problem solver, systems analyst, even been on Model Development Team for Boeing/McDonnell-Douglas.

So what happens if I have a lollipop/sucker in my mouth walking the halls, until I get outside? Isn't that active eating?
Think I will ask my daughter who is a flight attendant what she would do if a passenger was working on a sucker their entire flight. 

To my Royal Genie-

Please keep a fully stock jar of suckers in my room.
Also, a bag of popsicle sticks.

After all, would you stop Kojak and tell him that was not actively eating?

On 7/21/2021 at 1:12 PM, smokeybandit said:

Having a cruise port in Colorado sure would be nice.

You know we Rocky Mountain Folks are desperate for a cruise port when we line up with our luggage at the public pool, waiting to embark. Some of us even carrying ducks to hide.

As a Vaxed, I do not like the mask requirement. However, if I have to wear a mask so the Unvaxed can cruise if they want, then I am more than happy to do it.
I find it silly, but I will play the game for their sake.

To be-or not to be-that is the question.

Sorry, excuse me.
Just practicing my lines for the theater of acting like I really care about not allowing the unvaxed & unmasked sitting next to me.

All the cruise ship is a stage,
and all the men and women merely players:
they have their MDR, Casinos, and Theater exits and entrances;
and one man in his time plays many parts...

(Below is the CDC demanding I kiss their-- uh -- hand)
 

I am on Symphony Aug 21 with a B4B. All 4 had 1:00 pm as the earliest time to check in, and that was checking in within the first 15 minutes they were open.

It seems the ships may take longer to clean per the CSO, so it is still 6 hours but is now 1~7 pm.  

43 minutes ago, dswallow said:

Unfortunately you're ignoring a very important thing. Florida is not reporting daily statistics anymore. That "0" deaths is wrong. In addition when they made this change they also stopped reporting non-resident deaths from COVID (i.e., people who identify a residence from out of state but who were in Florida when they died), and further they also now only issue a very abbreviated report weekly which doesn't exactly disclose death numbers.

Sure, raw data is open to interpretation. But when data is withheld, what do you interpret from that?

So instead, data gets aggregated from other sources and updated as it is refined/corrected/supplemented from complete sources. It's a sad state. And I mean that both ways.

I tend to review data from  http://www.covidactnow.com first.

 

Thus, verification of the statement->

Don't trust the media's statistics until you do the deep research...but without the knowledge of how the stats are compiled, it is only a guess.

However, I note the site you reference still had 23 cases per 100,000

At least all sites appear to be ignoring equally.

2,700,000/100/000 = 27x23= 621 case*
*Per however the data for Florida is compiled and reported

Now the question is, how many were hospitalized, deaths, etc

then compare that to how many died of heart disease, cancer, lung disease, cerebrovascular disease, and Alzheimer's disease etc.

Then compare those cases against 2019, 2018 norms and projected for 2021. 
To see if there is overlap, thus the actual numbers for CV-19 may be blurred higher or lower.
At least then we could have something to compare and see just how much risk is real.

Perhaps that is why the Judge said the CDC had to use public data or provide the data,
not just talk generics.

Here is a site I use to check daily.

It seems to tell a different story when national hot spots are compared to Florida.

https://usafacts.org/visualizations/coronavirus-covid-19-spread-map

7-Day Average July 11th Miami-Dade
23 cases per 100,000    0 Deaths per 100,000

To show how deceptive data can be unless you look deeper.
That dark red in Montana is Powder River County.
7-Day average per 100,000 July 11th
161 Cases   17 deaths

However, the Population of Powder River County (2019) is 1,607
Don't trust the media's statistics until you do the deep research.

You can adjust the data by dividing the population of Miami-Dade by 100,000
then multiplying that number times 23.
Of course, whatever that number time zero deaths, is still quite low.
I am thinking it is less than .5 per 100,000, but without the knowledge of how the stats are compiled, it is only a guess.
 

37 minutes ago, AlmondFarmer said:

Being a numbers person it is hard to not critique an article like that. I will refrain from pointing out likely intentional statistical dishonesty again. 

Another surprising statistic:

50% of the graduates of Harvard are in the bottom half of their graduating class….I though they were all smart.

I used to teach Business Statistics for a college night class. My intro was always something like, "Tell me what you want the numbers to say, and I will get them for you."

They have to be careful not to insert their bias in the work, that is, if the goal is to get a true number, not a desired number.

What is the most popular color Floridians wear to basketball games?

You want the answer to the Poll to be BLUE?
I focus more weight on a Magic hosting the Dallas Mavericks game. Then add Magic/Heat and guess what?
I checked 2 locations and came up with BLUE!

So many ways to make it look fair, but when you dig into the details, it is what whoever wanted.

Then they can sell that data to the media and general public that does not understand.

"We checked both Florida NBA Teams, and overwhelmingly Floridians wear BLUE?"

Want the answer to the Poll color to be RED? I choose Heat/Magic & Heat/Rockets.

"We checked both Florida NBA Teams, and overwhelmingly Floridians wear RED?"

I would have the raw data to prove both correct (unless you dig into the details)

If it is not what I want, I may have to do another game with the color I want and a non-Red or non-Blue team.
Then the data looks more credible.

Same with political or CV-19 polls (Did I just say Tune Fish).
Tell me what you want, and I can get the number.

You have to look at any Poll in the media without the raw data with a skeptical eye.

On 7/10/2021 at 5:32 AM, twangster said:

The CDC has a lot to learn.  If you ask any Hollywood movie producer they'll you tell that a good scary movie title needs a good evil scary name.  

If so, then the next variant may be called the CV-19 'Murderer Variant.'
That should give the media enough room to scare everyone into getting vaccinated.

They can use scary music, then shock flash hospital beds on the screen.

I lost a cousin to CV-19 in January.
This constant reach for a new deadly variant name and hype is sort of insulting to the really deadly first version.

I don't want in 2025 to hear CV-19 A6Z9 variant.

What, me worry? I am vax'ed. Let the unvaxed board, sit at my MDR table, chat beside me in the casino, laugh and cheer at the entertainment right next to me, come visit my SC cabin without a mask, have the same freedoms I have on board. And children are not a problem with CV-19, so do not restrict others for bringing their children. It is a 'Family Cruise Line'.

Before any wonder, I am a father of 9, gained 6 more children when I remarried, 40 Grandchildren and Great-Grandchildren, but not to worry, none are cruising until March 2022, so I have no horse in the unvaxed children issue.

I understand the risks.
I understood them before I made the reservation, when the CDC had released no requirements.
I understood them when I made the reservation before there was a vaccine.

Some may feel me foolish, but the standard for rights in America has always metaphorically been, "Others freedoms end where my nose begins."

I know, airborne virus. But according to the same CDC that started this dilemma, I am all but no way a carrier or high risk for serious recipient of CV-19.

I am tired of Big Brother looking over my shoulder.



 

On 7/9/2021 at 12:31 PM, Matt said:

Nothing regarding Labadee has been changed.

@Matt As soon as I made my reservation for the Aug 21st Symphony, before I completed the payment and received my invoice, Royal had sent an email (time stamped while I was on the phone) announcing the change of itinerary from Labadee (Aug 23rd), Aruba, & Curaçao, to Nassau, St Thomas, St Maarten, St Kitts.

Per the letter, the reason was 'Due to changes in the port planning...' however, when that was lacking in explanation, several went further for an answer.

That answer was simply, 'Labadee.'

Even that hardly seems a good reason for wiping the entire itinerary so many months in advance, especially since my Symphony Aug 29th (B4B), months later still has Labadee on the itinerary Sept 1, only 8 days later. Before Odyssey's CV-19 problems, it was going to Labadee before the Aug 23rd.

If you can find out more, our Facebook Group would appreciate it. So many of us scheduled the cruise simply for Aruba & Curaçao. We understand last minute changes, but when they come months in advance, and before my full payment (at the time of reservation it was in the 80s days) and invoice sent, while others were still going to Labadee, they had to throw out the entire, enticing factors of the cruise (Oasis class to the ABCs), was extremely disappointing. I had canceled my 'Horizon' on that other line, waiting for an Oasis Southern Caribbean.

 @Pam13 Our cruise agreed with you, Coco Cay was a far better substitute for Labadee than what we got. Be grateful, you at least you still have Aruba.
We would have felt better if they had at least left us one of the ABCs. Instead, Royal wiped out our only private and all of our ABCs itinerary.

Hurricane, yes, we understand. The luck of the draw. Adjustments as we restart, yes we understand, we all have to be flexible.
But because of Labadee? Something is going on.
 

1 hour ago, smokeybandit said:

I still have about $200 of taxes and port fees from a March cruise that RC is always "still looking into" when I inquire.

A TA convinced me to move my cruises to them. When I became unhappy with poor service, I moved them back to Royal.

Scenario 1-
Now even the TA admits I have $232 paid missing when my SY Aug 29th cruise  account was moved back.
The answer was, "Not to worry. I called Royal, and they said your wife has a lot of FCC sitting there."

Scenario-2
Well, that was the Alaska cruise. BTW, where is my missing FCC from that cruise?
Also, the FCC for the 2 cruises for both of us canceled back in early May?

Scenario-3
Meanwhile, I had Royal already open up research on why over $1,000 paid to the same TA for Vision Nov 22nd 2021, Jr Suite is missing.
That was a month ago. I even emailed Royal all my receipts and a screenshot of the page showing how much I paid per the TAs records.

Additionally, a couple of the TAs for the firm that were trying to help me when I first found these issues and said to call them back personally, are no longer working for the firm.

And those are just 3 scenarios. 
Any wonder why I took back my cruises.

I will never use that TA again, no matter what they offer.

The name of the firm is withheld. They were terrible on many accounts, but I do not want to list them without their having a chance to reply.

@WAAAYTOOO  is CruisingPower only for Agents?

Also, to you, @Matt, @AshleyDillo,  or anyone, 

there is a bit of discussion on 'Royal Up' on the SY Aug 21 Facebook page.

My belief is that if a passenger wins a 'Royal Up' from, for example, a Sea Class to Star Class 
They keep their Sea Class perks & benefits, such as
Dinner access to Coastal Kitchen / Specialty Bottle Water / Luxury Bath Amenities
But they do not get the Royal Genie, etc.

Others seem to think if they win the cabin, they win all the perks & benefits.

Royal does not give an example in the FAQs. It just states:

A: The Royal Up upgrade does not include any additional promotions.
However, you get to keep whichever promotions you already have.

Without an example, the confusion here is the word "Promotion" since sales are promotions, etc.
If they gave an example, or at minimum, added 'Cabin Promotions', it seems like it would be clearer.

13 hours ago, WAAAYTOOO said:

Holy cow.  I apologize but I couldn't follow all of that. It seems to me that you are considering converting a B4B (which would become a B3B due to cancelling the first leg 8-21-21) on SY for a B2B Star Class on AL.

If that is the scenario, then I think you have already answered your own question !  LOL  B2B Star Class would win (for me) every time.  ESPECIALLY given the awful new itinerary of the 8-21-21 SY. Of course, you are losing 2 nights with that switch but since they are both multiple leg cruises I doubt you would even miss the 2 nights.
...

BTW, my husband receives a pension from Boeing (and Lockheed and General Dynamics !!).  He moved around during those early years !!

@WAAAYTOOO, you followed it quite well.

It is great to have the input of someone who has been in a Star Class GP/OP Oasis cabin.

Yes, I have the Jan 30th Allure GP reserved.
Yes, the Allure GP has the small balcony with the hot tub. The trade-off of a small, but adequate, balcony for the bedroom view looks to be a more than equal.

Wished we were on the same cruise. I always enjoy talking aerospace. Your husband did it right. To work in the aerospace field, you have to be part gypsy, traveling to the contracts as they are issued. I retired from Boeing/MDC, mother made the cores for the computer at Lockheed Compton for years, father and stepbrother retired from GE Evandale, where they built the jet engines. I was offered a job at General Dynamics. We both have a hat-trick background. We would get along just fine.

Just not sure what you wives would talk about? In fact, that could be scary. LOL

PS: Thanks for updating me on the proper acronyms B3B & B4B. That sure is a lot easier to read and type.
 

@WAAAYTOOO We may--or may not, be joining you.

We are booked on this Aug 21, in a GS. However, I booked it after the restart was announced when the costs were higher. 

The original itinerary and being the frontend of a B2B2B2B (Aug 21 ~ Sept 18th) was our reasoning. As you noted, losing Aruba & Curaçao because of Labadee is a crusher.

Our advantage is we still cruise on Symphony, only starting 8-Nights later, Aug 29 in an A2, then GSs through Sept 18th. That gives us more options. 

I would appreciate your well experienced opinion on my options.

If I cancel my Aug 21 GS, for a Feb 5, 2022, Allure Central Park View, cash the Aug 21 FCC, and add only $2,000 (plus travel and 2-Night Hotel), I can sail the exact current itinerary, except Dominica Republic instead of Nassau. But that is not the kicker.

I booked Feb 05 as the back end of a B2B before the restart was announced.
The frontend is the Jan 30, 2022 6-Night Star Class, Grand Panoramic. The cost between the Symphony Aug 21 8-Night Post-Restart and Allure Jan 30 6-Night Pre-Restart is that $2,000 difference after applying the FCC.

Best of all, the wife has no idea I booked the GP. It will be a surprise. She is my Queen.
Even not having the Star experience, I have a feeling I would love seeing her to receive that treatment.

I feel silly asking. Seems like the cabin upgrade and experience should be a no-brainer, even without considering the scenario of the itinerary change from Aruba & Curaçao. Problem is, I have no way to compare it.

My only prior Royal Caribbean was on Empress--in a Balcony. I have no way to compare a Star Class to Sky, let alone Symphony or Allure.

The only outside consideration is the wife's schedule. I am retired Boeing Aerospace Mgmt, so time is just time.
She is a Labor & Delivery RN, 3 years from retirement. 
Saving up vacation time for retirement is nice, but--
taking an amazing "Vacay" is better. 

@WAAAYTOOO, you have a lot of cruising in Star and Sky experience. Am I correct, once we get closer to the date, if everything is working toward normal, canceling the Symphony Aug 21 GS front end of a B2B2B2B, for Allure B2B Star Experience makes canceling a no-brainer?

After typing all this, I am looking at it, saying to myself, "I have to ask?"


 

15 hours ago, JeffB said:

Clearly this is in interesting discussion that highly informed folks are contributing. Fundamentally, a debate might boil down to whether or not RCL values their image as a company with ethics - in this case a willingness to place public perception over profits.

...

We can probably answer the legal question easily: Is RCL obligated to refund a cruise fare? The answer is found under the rules the company has established in the cruise contract every passenger agrees to. IMO, knowing what I know about cruise contracts and the circumstance at hand, the answer is no.

Immediately, that defaults the system within which this question is being debated to the realm of ethics and morals...One can dance around all the niceties of should and could do this or that, but it's going to boil down to the question that RCL execs are going to have to answer. I have no doubt, they know the cost and how much they are willing to pay for good will, PR, retaining loyal customers and grabbing up customers from other companies who will pay less for those things than RCL might, losing some of them in the process that then switch over to RCL

I think big corporations of today care much less about the ethics and morality of their choices than they do about share prices, profits and executive pay.  That trend has been ongoing for a long time. Those are the hard truths that underlay this particular debate. The weight of those truths tend to tip the scales of justice in one particular way that isn't favorable for the OP and those who post in support of him as much as his position - give the man his money back - is ethically and morally appealing.  That, and what  @CruiseGus has to say about this. 

As a stockholder of a number of shares and calls, my hope is the Royal Execs see beyond the short term, even though it is important right now, and think long term. I do not expect my RCL to do better than my TeSLA. However, I do see this moment in time a fantastic opportunity to present an expanded version of 'Our Passengers Come First.'

I have 'Diamond Hands' which means I intend to 'Hold' onto my shares long term and not sell. Though it does fit with the Loyalty status. I want Royal Execs to be thinking long term. I can ride out any small term pull back in good news impacting the stock. First responsibility is survival, next is long term survival.

Execs to often in times of stress like these, trip over tomorrow's dollars to pick up today's pennies. Avoid having short term pennies block the vision of long term dollars. 

Loyalty is another place where a small change can cost perhaps little or nothing, but make a big impact on customer loyalty. The distance between Diamond Plus and Pinnacle is huge. Sure, there are in between advantages. But you have to read the small print about 240 points additions, etc. What? Was someone too lazy to make those level breaks? Run out of gems for a new category? Did they think making a new category would widen the chart and make it too busy? That tiny dot is easy to read, folks. Those tiny 240 breakouts lettering down the left-hand column are not easy to read with older eyes. In case no one has noticed, the level to 700 points will take so much time that a majority of those reaching those levels will be older eyes.

Think outside the box! There has never been a more important time to think that way in cruise line industry history. This from a person who worked for McDonnell-Douglas and retired from Boeing McDonnell-Douglas and knows the history of how it used to be Douglas Aircraft, but fell to McDonnell-Douglas.

You do not do like Mr. McDonnell and order a case of peas, open each can, count the number in each can, and average them out. Then divide the number of Shareholders coming into the minimum number of cases that can be purchase. Finally, require the Chefs at the next Shareholders dinner to put exactly X-number of peas on each plate because that is the number of cases you are buying. Good idea on saving cases of peas. However, how much costs for the Chef's time? You either need to hire more Chefs, have the Chefs work longer hours to get the count right, or have Shareholders have to wait longer for a colder meal. All when you could donate those cases to charity and get a write-off. The later could result in lower per case acquisition costs because of the extra quantity of case bought, in lower Chef production costs, happier Shareholder in fresh served meals, and better PR image by a news release and big promotion of the donation event. All this beyond the good of being seen as community friendly for a small or perhaps, after all things considered, for little or no costs.

Here is a current example of what I mean about the story of Mr McDonnell and the peas. I have a local well known sub sandwich company that recently switched to very thin sliced turkey meat. This is obviously some accountant's idea of saving money. However, with my management background, looking from the other side of the glass as the sandwich is prepared, there are two huge and obvious flaws. First, it is so thin it takes the employee longer to separate the meat, thus any advantage in reducing costs is lost in the increase of employee to make each sandwich. Second, the customer is right there looking at the struggle and recognizes they are spending extra time waiting while the employee struggles, plus the struggle highlights there has been a change in the amount of product for their same amount or higher payment.

Sometimes, in the attempt to 'Save Cost for a Better ROI' and company bottom line, the best decisions are made looking at the entire system, not the projected numbers on a sheet of paper.

As a stockholder, I do hope the Royal Execs are paying attention to this hopefully 'Once in a Lifetime' untypical opportunity. Watch knowing the situation is going to cause other lines to make significant PR  errors. To seek out, focus on, and promote places where with little or no costs, up to reasonable appreciation for future long term loyal customers and act swiftly and with force over the competition.

I think to have chosen this time to expand and return to the Port of Los Angeles with a ship the size of Navigator, knowing the risk of being there with a smaller ship than the competition, is an example of such thinking. In a few years when the financials change, to double down and be the first on the West Coast with their own Cay would more than counter any competition in ship size or customer loyalty as right now the port selection is otherwise so small. It would change up the entire West Coast customer choice consideration, bringing in new customers and returning former customers they lost when they left the West Coast a decade ago.

If Congress passes the Bill by Senator Lee eliminating the need to stop in at least one foreign port, there is another opportunity for Royal to leap frog the competition. They had Former Federal Health & Human Services Secretary Mike Leavitt on their Safe Sail Committee. I know Secretary Leavitt and Senator Lee are friends, because I know both very well and helped both in their first election victories. That is a 'Little to Free' opportunity to work for the benefit of customers, if it has not already been happening behind the scenes.

Avoid jumping to the quick strategy meeting of how to make the most profit at the moment. Think survival at the moment with eyes on long term. What resources are already or can be added for little or free to the Royal Execs Tool Box? How can they be used in these unusual times to exponentially grow the customer loyalty base long term? What is the true costs in finances and customer loyalty of each decision? Do we serve thin turkey that is harder to handle and impact customers time and wallet to their face? Do we count peas in a case and average out? Or do we consider all things in the system for short term survival and their long term impact?

My apologies for the length.

3 hours ago, ConstantCruiser said:

I'm two or three cruises short of platinum on Carnival which is comparable to RCI Diamond in terms of points level and level of effort to achieve.  

Royal's loyalty program is significantly better at the Diamond level and above.  Below this level both loyalty programs don't do a whole lot.

I stopped cruising Carnival a few years ago not because I ever had a bad cruise with them but because I was left wanting something a little more...  

 

@ConstantCruiser I feel about the same.

There is a YouTube on this comparison. Royal mostly won. Just search for Royal Caribbean vs Carnival or vice-versa and plenty will show up.

My only Royal was Empress. My last of 4 or 5 Carnival was Inspiration. Neither is part of the fleets.
My Carnival Inspiration was last March 2020, the last cruise before the No Sail Order. 
Even without Covid-19, my outside cabin showed signs of being ready for the Turkey scrapyard, where is now sits in pieces.

The pizza tasted like cardboard with tomato sauce, if you could find someone to man the counter.
I was forced to live off Guy Burgers. It was a pretty good excuse and after tasting the pizza, the wife bought it.

I used to walk down the pier looking at the newer, larger Royal ship next to me, thinking, "Some day."
Even though Empress was the smallest and oldest ship in the Royal Fleet, it impressed me enough to swing to Royal.
When I got off Empress, my only reason to go back to Carnival was the cruise port.

Carnival cruised out of Long Beach in March 2020, and Royal did not.
That changes in November 2021, when Navigator returns to the Port of Los Angeles for the first time in a decade.
I am booked on it March 2022.

On 6/15/2021 at 11:33 AM, JimnKathy said:

Sounds like a frustrating experience.

We sail on a Symphony B2B (Eastern/Western Caribbean) beginning Sep 18, and I fully expect the itinerary to flex between now and the actual sailing date due to constant shuffling of the COVID/CDC/Government deck chairs. 

We're just grateful to be sailing and will find ways to have a fabulous 14 days (easy peasy on Symphony  ) regardless of the ports of call we actually visit.

Happy sailing to everyone!

 

@JimnKathy Hearing that just being on Symphony can be a fabulous trip is comforting. This will be my first time on Symphony.
However, I went big. B2B2B2B Aug 21~Sept 18.
I will wave at you when disembarking.
I almost added the Sept 18 instead of Aug 21, but Aug 21st was originally to go to Aruba & Curaçao, now Nassau as far south as St Kitts.
Disappointing to the majority of the cruise. Many cancelled. Most, like myself, are just happy to be back onboard.
However, I have an advantage. For me, it is only 1 cruise out of 4.

If Aug 21~Aug 29 is the only cruise itinerary of my B2B2B2B that has port changes, I will consider myself extremely fortunate.

I am not sure the original message was clear enough. My apologies. 
I am a retired Fortune 20 trained manager.
As such, I was trained all of us have things we would do for free (Volunteer) and things we would not do despite the pay. 

We are early into the flood of flux and dynamics in the cruising restart.
We understand the great job all have done to get things started again.

However, when there is flux, Royal is currently using the Pre-Covid NSO/CSO standard boilerplate forms and letters.
While those were good and sufficient for those times, they do not fit today's flux and dynamic changes on the fly that have happened, are happening and are coming.

I could put it this way.

With growth comes change.
How many of us can wear the same coat we wore to kindergarten and have it fit as well?
As our children grow, we purchase, make, or acquire new clothes to fit them.

We passengers have grown through these untypical times.
Royal has grown through these untypical times.
We are both still growing and will continue to grow into and through things returning to normal.

With that change, the old ways need to adapt and change.

By small changes to the old Pre-Covid NSO/CSO boilerplate form letters
Royal would be sending a signal to passengers that would better fit today's changes with better explanations.
The passengers would be reassured with the newer, larger coat of letter and communications that Royal hears their concerns.
An assured passenger, like many of the more experienced passengers above, will be willing to suspend even more expectations.

Can Royal get by with the old explanations? Sure. But there will be a cost with some passengers.
Why not let the other lines do that and pay the price?
When those passengers drop their current lines,
pick up those free cruise loving passengers and keep more of the old Royal passengers,
with but a tiny effort into reassuring and recognition?
Nothing that hits the bottom line other than the time to change a few forms,
and perhaps a couple of news releases, which are free advertising?

A small change that would do wonders for Public Relations with passengers.
It will go much further than telling us, "Expect the Unexpected."
It would say, "We appreciate your suspending expectations and are working hard to return things to normal. Your input and patience is appreciated."

It reassures passengers their untypical suspensions of expectations are fully in Royal's thoughts.
It reassures Royal recognizes the passengers may not be pleased
However, it is a partnership where the passengers understand and are doing their part by being untypically tolerant with Royal.
It recognizes and puts the focus on the passenger's growth, not the flux Royal is experiencing and fighting.
It makes the passengers just as important and heroic in their own way as the hardworking crews.

That higher (growth) recognition, something the old boilerplate do not recognize, actually creates a new level of loyalty.
Royal would keep some passengers they would otherwise lose, and gain more passengers other lines lost.
Why? Because that recognition by Royal incorporates the passengers as part of the solution.

I am not dismissing anything Royal and Royal staff did, is doing, or will do.
I am explaining a small tweak that will help recognize the times and grow passengers loyalty.
A small short term, almost free change of attitude and perspective, that will create a stronger bond between Royal and passengers.
 
It's a PR thing.

I have had itineraries, FCC, payments, and other things work to my favor and disfavor in this restart. Here is my take on it.

We passengers recognize these are untypical times.
Royal is not perfect. Nor is Royal expected to be in these untypical times.

Untypical times require untypical understanding and expectations.

Passengers are willing to suspend typical expectations.
Royal recognizes these untypical times and are giving passengers untypical exceptions.

Passengers expect and understand there may be dynamic changes to our planned cruises.
Royal appreciates passengers' understanding.

If Royal is making mistakes and not aware, I am sure Royal wants to know, so they can fix them.
Passengers expect untypical explanations for untypical mistakes or changes. 

Royal should recognize typical answers like, 'Port Planning' or 'It is in the contract' are insufficient answer in these untypical times.
Pre-NSO/CSO boilerplate form letters do not address today's untypical scenarios.
It is a mismatch when passengers Apple problems receive Orange answers.

Expect the unexpected needs to be balance with
Untypical times require untypical explanations.

Untypical transparency would confirm Royal is aware of the problems, recognizes them, and is asking for passengers understanding, while working on solutions.
It reassures passengers their untypical concerns are fully in Royal's thoughts.
 
It's a PR thing.

Think I will make this more generic on a new topic for all cruises.

3 hours ago, ChrisK2793 said:

This is the part that I’m sure is what frustrated and annoyed him and many others the most.  He booked ON THE PHONE, the RCL website still listed the original itinerary, the agent on the phone apparently was never told by RCL the itinerary changed, and then he received a Notice of Itinerary Change BEFORE he even received the receipt for the cruise he’d just booked on the phone which comes within minutes of booking.

So RCL obviously knew they changed the itinerary BEFORE he booked, but yet they never told him on the phone when he was making his reservation, obviously they never even told their own phone reservation agents, RCL also kept advertising the original itinerary on their website for days after he booked and after he immediately upon booking received an email saying the itinerary had changed.  For anybody to tell him he is wrong to be upset about the way this was handled, you are the ones being ridiculous.  

How long even before he booked had RCL been taking reservations on an itinerary they already knew wasn’t happening and then IMMEDIATELY sending an email saying the itinerary had changed once the people were booked?  That’s just ridiculous!

For me personally? Bingo! In fact, my scenario was worse than that.

I put the cruise on hold at 1:25 pm, June 7th.
I call back to confirm the booking 90 minutes later, of which an hour is on hold till about 3:45pm. The booking online is still the original itinerary.
The agent confirms the reservation and the original itinerary as is procedure. Verify names, ship, date, and itinerary.
I am unaware Royal has sent an email timestamp 3:52 pm, while the agent and I discuss FCC and finalize payment.
We complete payment and the agent sends the receipt timestamp 4:15 pm. I confirm it was received.
While printing out the Cruise Receipt, I notice the Royal change of itinerary 23 minutes before I finished paying for the booking.

In the military, we would have called it a 'Total SNAFU' (Pardon my expression).

I could pass it off as each booked passenger has their stories.

But everyone on this Blog should take heed. Today this is my cruise.
But with all the flux everyone has been expressing as possible reasons, are examples of how tomorrow, this could be any cruise over the next 3 months.

Zero confidence in booking. Zero confidence in itinerary. 'Can I please have more NSO/CSO, Mr. CDC?'

We all know Royal and all cruise lines had to cut back to bare bones, and now trying to get back up to full speed overnight with new people.
Even though many of the new people are fantastic, we all know the computer programs could have used some improvements before the NSO.
Royal was never prepared for so much flux, 'Port Planning,' and FCC out there at one time.

Sometimes the errors are in pax favors. They made a mistake on the pricing of my Navigator March 25th, 2022, out of Los Angeles. A big mistake!
But how did Royal handle it? Pam in Revenue Management called and told me of the mistake, however, Royal would honor the price as long as we make no changes to the cabin reservation (anything else is fine). Pam and bad news? She could make that dirty dishwater taste like gourmet soup--with garnishments.

So do I have a right to complain personally? It seems to have all balanced out. However, not everyone on the cruise has had such luck.
I am carrying their questions to this board looking for help, as well as a heads up for all to be prepared.

Update-- What I noticed last night when I re-read the posts, even my own, that now St Thomas is missing. Has it been removed for 'Port Planning' now?
That can be seen in my top post attachment. Where is Day-4 St Thomas? Is there another itinerary change coming?

Ampurp85, Boy do we realize how lucky we realize how lucky we are to afford 28-Nights in 4 Grand Suites or above B2B2B2B.
Not just lucky, but extremely lucky to have the financial ability, cabins left, and we could arrange the time off.
Plus, I am retired, so a lot easier for me. With Voom, I can watch my investments from the water almost as easy as home. Again, a little luck.
Finally, not just B2B2B2B, but Symphony B2B2B2B?

Thank you, Royal. Thanks for all you have done to get back up and sailing so quickly, despite all the obstacles.
Former Federal Health & Human Services Secretary Mike Leavitt on the Safe Sail committee is a personal friend. Thanks, Mike, for all your efforts, too.
 

1 hour ago, cruisellama said:

Still sailing from and returning 2 Miami.  That's the same.  Small consolation.

Ah, Cruisellama. I love your positive attitude. You put a smile on my face.

I am not impacted like the others on the August 21st cruise. 

Aug 21st, is the first of a B2B2B2B on Symphony for me. 4Xs for 28-Nights, August 21~September 18th.

Can you tell I am suffering from the withdrawals of CDC NSO/CSO Syndrome?
Every time I take a shower, being that close to so much water gives me the shakes.
Sometimes they have to call the EMTs to drag my water logged, shriveled body out.

Therefore, I must waive the luxury of disembarking on the return to Miami. The Symphony Lounge sounds like a better stop than Port Miami. I hear they may have food.

But not getting off is my doings, not Royal's. 
Well, unless you consider Royal a contributing factor by enticing me with such great cruise itineraries after the CDC forced me into that 16-month withdrawal period.

My August 29th is an A2, unless Royal would like to put in a better suite. (Are there any better? Well, maybe the Royal Suite. Maybe).

I hope my fellow Insiders understands, I love Royal Caribbean Cruises.
When I used to sail with that one that is not Celebrity, but starts with a C (phtt, phtt), looking around I would think,
'I guess "Choose The Fun" on a cruise ship means bunny hopping around the Lido Pool to oldies music."
In port, I would look over and skyward at Royal Caribbean ships and think to myself, "Hmm, no bunny hop music. What's going on over there?" 

By noon, August 29th, I expect to have personally forgotten all about the August 21st~August 29th change of itinerary. 

I just feel sad for my fellow August 21st passengers. For example, one who has already been to Nassau 23 times.
(Funny how much Nassau sounds like Cozumel). We all booked the original itinerary hoping to see something new. 
All of us were aware of the risk. All of us who didn't cancel accept the change. Just would like a better answer.

Considering all the other Royal ships going to those same ports, in the same general time frames, they deserve a better answer than 'Port Planning.'

But Cruisellama, thank you for the smile!