stevendom57 Posted September 24, 2020 Report Share Posted September 24, 2020 These recommendations are totally incomplete. No mention at all was made whether hiding rubber ducks would be allowed. Neesa, teddy, JLMoran and 5 others 1 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisellama Posted September 26, 2020 Report Share Posted September 26, 2020 On 9/24/2020 at 5:46 PM, stevendom57 said: These recommendations are totally incomplete. No mention at all was made whether hiding rubber ducks would be allowed. You're right. Need a sanitizing protocol for the ducks before they're brought on board JLMoran and Neesa 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neesa Posted September 26, 2020 Report Share Posted September 26, 2020 The 5 days to 24 hours previous COVID test is my only concern, do the 5 days include weekend days? A rapid test has various turn around times, what if you are sailing on Monday? Do you get tested the previous Wednesday and hope the results are back in hand to take to the port on Monday? I don't see the testing centers being to happy about testing "cruisers" I researched previously and unless you tell a fib and say you feel sick or may have been exposed will they test? Seriously I think this could be a possible sticking point and depending where the test is inside vs drive thru are we exposing ourselves to other illness like the flu etc! Yikes, I love everything else stipulated as it all makes sense, this one not so much. If you test negative but then are exposed within the 5 day timeframe (maybe not even know it) was that just an exercise in futility? We are being tested and screened at the Port before being allowed to embark, if we must test before hand at least allow 7 days be the benchmark to account for the weekend days? Any thoughts? Just thinking out loud about this hurdle on my end, even before COVID we pretty much self isolated for 2 weeks previous any sailing so as not to pick up a bug to bring and share on board, no extra activities for the ultimate enjoyment of our sailing, things are finally looking up! Let's do this! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLMoran Posted September 26, 2020 Report Share Posted September 26, 2020 2 hours ago, Neesa said: If you test negative but then are exposed within the 5 day timeframe (maybe not even know it) was that just an exercise in futility? It's definitely not an exercise in futility. Since a person can be infected with the virus for up to 10 days before they start showing symptoms, this is going to be a critical means of finding asymptomatic passengers and making sure they don't board the ship when they have a chance to be super-spreaders. Yes, you can absolutely be exposed without knowing it inside the 5-day window, or get back a negative test because you were infected just a day or two before you took it and had too little to show up. And this is where all of the boarding and on-board protocols come into play, working as a series of defensive barriers to reduce (but not 100% eliminate) the risk of spread during the trip. Regarding your original question of whether weekend days count, I'm not really sure. It likely depends on the lab the test is sent to: how well-staffed is it? Are they currently working to process tests on weekends? Is the place that took the test sending the specimens by same-day / next-day courier? When my daughter went for a test after learning she might have been exposed, the test was given on a Saturday night close to 11 PM. She had her results that Monday afternoon, less than 48 hours later. Had she gotten the test Friday night instead of Saturday, I'm guessing that she still would not have had her results until Monday. For the folks who have noted before that she might have gotten super-expedited results because of the confirmed exposure risk, her roommate is getting tested weekly or maybe bi-weekly because he works on the college campus in the admissions office. He's getting his results back pretty consistently inside 48 hours. Neesa and teddy 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew72681 Posted September 26, 2020 Report Share Posted September 26, 2020 59 minutes ago, JLMoran said: It's definitely not an exercise in futility. Since a person can be infected with the virus for up to 10 days before they start showing symptoms, this is going to be a critical means of finding asymptomatic passengers and making sure they don't board the ship when they have a chance to be super-spreaders. Yes, you can absolutely be exposed without knowing it inside the 5-day window, or get back a negative test because you were infected just a day or two before you took it and had too little to show up. And this is where all of the boarding and on-board protocols come into play, working as a series of defensive barriers to reduce (but not 100% eliminate) the risk of spread during the trip. Regarding your original question of whether weekend days count, I'm not really sure. It likely depends on the lab the test is sent to: how well-staffed is it? Are they currently working to process tests on weekends? Is the place that took the test sending the specimens by same-day / next-day courier? When my daughter went for a test after learning she might have been exposed, the test was given on a Saturday night close to 11 PM. She had her results that Monday afternoon, less than 48 hours later. Had she gotten the test Friday night instead of Saturday, I'm guessing that she still would not have had her results until Monday. For the folks who have noted before that she might have gotten super-expedited results because of the confirmed exposure risk, her roommate is getting tested weekly or maybe bi-weekly because he works on the college campus in the admissions office. He's getting his results back pretty consistently inside 48 hours. Last week there was an exposure in the accounting department in the plant where my product is produced. My boss and ten others were able to get test results back within fifteen minutes of showing up. Neesa and JLMoran 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisellama Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 The pre-travel test may be inconvenient, but its a way to mitigate travel risk prior the air or car ride to the port. I would take the pre-travel test on embarkation (- 4 days) to mitigate the chance I'm not traveling with it and then get surprised during the embarkation process. Understand the embarkation day test. This won''t be a permanent situation, but if you're wanting to get back soonest, you'll have to partake the the extra diligence. Fill the squares, cooperate and graduate and these things will pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 The most important part of the document is on page 52 That agreements must first be reached with countries and ports of call that will allow ships to enter and to disembark crew and passengers that have Covid-19. In other words if no caribbean island agrees to allow ships to disembark Covid-19 patients then there will be no caribbean cruises. So in reality if no country in the world agrees then there is no cruising WAAAYTOOO and JLMoran 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 11 hours ago, cruisellama said: The pre-travel test may be inconvenient, but its a way to mitigate travel risk prior the air or car ride to the port. Agreed. There is no single recommendation that is a "silver bullet" approach. If there were, all the other recommendations wouldn't be necessary. The Panel's approach is like a mesh, where all these different changes (masks, testing, social distancing, etc) aren't enough to prevent things on their own, but together, significantly reduce the likelihood of there being a case without it being caught at one point to mitigate the spread. 4ensic and USFFrank 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisellama Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 4 minutes ago, Matt said: Agreed. There is no single recommendation that is a "silver bullet" approach. If there were, all the other recommendations wouldn't be necessary. The Panel's approach is like a mesh, where all these different changes (masks, testing, social distancing, etc) aren't enough to prevent things on their own, but together, significantly reduce the likelihood of there being a case without it being caught at one point to mitigate the spread. The panel highlighted that nothing is 100%. We're now in the stage of risk management/mitigation - lets get to it. We'll have some success and a few failures - but doing nothing only cedes to defeat. Even in failures, we learn, and find ways to avoid them next time around. Matt and USFFrank 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevendom57 Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 @cruisellamaI agree. As an engineer I know that there is only so much planning that you can do. Eventually you have to go ahead and run tests. It never fails, something will not work right, but you fix it and run more tests. Eventually you get it right. The cruise lines need to plan and implement what they think will work and give it a limited test. Refine what didn't work and test again. Eventually it will be sufficient. Having said that, the one thing that they cannot do is to lock everyone on board and not let the go if there is a breakout. Doing that at the beginning of this breakout will forever be a black eye on the industry and give reason for critics to call them petri dishes. USFFrank 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisellama Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 1 hour ago, stevendom57 said: @cruisellamaI agree. As an engineer I know that there is only so much planning that you can do. Eventually you have to go ahead and run tests. It never fails, something will not work right, but you fix it and run more tests. Eventually you get it right. The cruise lines need to plan and implement what they think will work and give it a limited test. Refine what didn't work and test again. Eventually it will be sufficient. Having said that, the one thing that they cannot do is to lock everyone on board and not let the go if there is a breakout. Doing that at the beginning of this breakout will forever be a black eye on the industry and give reason for critics to call them petri dishes. I think the reduced capacity recommendation for early sailings is another mitigation technique to minimize breakout. Might even be appropriate to message early cruising as protocol validation. "Attention all passengers , as part of being part of the first cruise experience after shutdown, you are all privileged to be part of our new and amazing health protocols. Enjoy your vacation and we look forward to remotely monitor you complete the Muster 2.0 drill. " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew72681 Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 2 hours ago, Matt said: Agreed. There is no single recommendation that is a "silver bullet" approach. If there were, all the other recommendations wouldn't be necessary. The Panel's approach is like a mesh, where all these different changes (masks, testing, social distancing, etc) aren't enough to prevent things on their own, but together, significantly reduce the likelihood of there being a case without it being caught at one point to mitigate the spread. Silver Bullet? I thought that meant Bob Seger had all the answers JLMoran, 4ensic and Matt 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4ensic Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 1 hour ago, Andrew72681 said: Silver Bullet? I thought that meant Bob Seger had all the answers He does, as long as you're not sailing Against the Wind. Matt, WAAAYTOOO, Neesa and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 7 hours ago, cruisellama said: The panel highlighted that nothing is 100%. We're now in the stage of risk management/mitigation - lets get to it. We'll have some success and a few failures - but doing nothing only cedes to defeat. Even in failures, we learn, and find ways to avoid them next time around. Yes, completely agree. There is nothing that is completely risk free, but risk mitigation is a very real and practical approach to everything, including resuming cruises. ehw51, Neesa and USFFrank 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew72681 Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 5 minutes ago, Matt said: Yes, completely agree. There is nothing that is completely risk free, but risk mitigation is a very real and practical approach to everything, including resuming cruises. That’s one thing I think gets overlooked. Every time you wake up in the morning you go through a litany of risk assessments throughout the day. Baked Alaska and cruisellama 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jmccaffrey Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 Hope this helps RC to start sailing again!!!!!! cruisellama 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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