GJ_123 Posted January 26 Report Share Posted January 26 1 hour ago, ScottD said: Well, that's kinda sad but if that's what people prefer, then glad they can do it without being questioned. I'm also curious as to how service changes when this is done, as I believe room attendants and servers see who is and isn't pre-paid, but never did get confirmation on that I don't think it's sad at all. It's an optional gratuity and I would much rather tip more generously in cash. When I first started cruising with RC I spoke to many staff members who actually politely discouraged me from adding a tip to the receipt, and said a cash tip would mean far more to them. So to answer your question about 'how service changes' I think you'll find you are given much better service if they know you tip well in cash, that will mean far more to them than knowing you've put money into a generic tip pool. CanHardlyWait 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GJ_123 Posted January 26 Report Share Posted January 26 59 minutes ago, ScottD said: I believe room attendants and servers see who is and isn't pre-paid, but never did get confirmation on that Regarding room attendants/servers seeing who is pre-paid, I highly doubt it. Why would that information be relevant to them? CanHardlyWait and PeloAl 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXcruzer Posted January 26 Report Share Posted January 26 1 hour ago, GJ_123 said: Regarding room attendants/servers seeing who is pre-paid, I highly doubt it. Why would that information be relevant to them? Furthermore, let them know I have removed the auto gratuity. When someone knows they are working for a cash reward, I believe service improves. Where is the incentive to perform when you know you are already guaranteed a pre paid minimum? THIS is how gratuities are supposed to work. CanHardlyWait 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonCruiser Posted January 26 Report Share Posted January 26 2 hours ago, TXcruzer said: Furthermore, let them know I have removed the auto gratuity. When someone knows they are working for a cash reward, I believe service improves. Where is the incentive to perform when you know you are already guaranteed a pre paid minimum? THIS is how gratuities are supposed to work. Adam Ruins Everything taught me that our(ie American) tipping custom actually dates back to gangsters and the like sliding extra money (aka bribery) to their servers for better service (and you know...to ignore the crimes happening probably). Then, when big bad bosses caught wind of this they figured..oh well why should I pay you when the customer is paying you?, so then they cut back on employees wages. Only that practice stayed even though most of us aren't gangsters, because cutting employee wages nicely lines the pockets of corporate. And corporate always cares about corporate first. So, tipping wasn't/isn't about - do good and you'll get some undisclosed amount of money. If anything it was, "here's some extra money, keep serving me better than you do the others and I'll give you more of what you're already seeing" So tipping up front and then adding more later...very classic way. Also, modern tipping, in my view, should be a sign of appreciation for someone going above and beyond the expected services. So like when my stateroom attendant made towel animals every night, or made sure to keep our suite stocked with large coffee cups, or when they chased down to find our missing luggage. Things outside of their normal duties that they do because they want to make my experience better than average. Anyway - here's the video. I think this is a clip from a longer show but i skimmed and it should talk about it and cite sources. ScottD, WAAAYTOOO and Mike.s 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanHardlyWait Posted January 26 Report Share Posted January 26 (edited) 7 hours ago, ScottD said: Well, that's kinda sad but if that's what people prefer, then glad they can do it without being questioned. I'm also curious as to how service changes when this is done, as I believe room attendants and servers see who is and isn't pre-paid, but never did get confirmation on Edited January 26 by CanHardlyWait Repeat post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanHardlyWait Posted January 26 Report Share Posted January 26 (edited) 8 hours ago, ScottD said: Well, that's kinda sad but if that's what people prefer, then glad they can do it without being questioned. I'm also curious as to how service changes when this is done, as I believe room attendants and servers see who is and isn't pre-paid, but never did get confirmation on that You know you claimed to not want to tell people how to tip and then say this last ditch statement all people make in this argument. LOL. What would be the point of telling staff? Hopefully to try even harder for a cash tip. Not to give it bare minimum because an automatic gratuity isn't coming. To answer your question about being curious how service changes when this is done. It's been my experience that service stays exactly the same. If anything it improves. If anyone has concerns about service changing wait till 2 days before end of trip to have automatic gratuities removed. I personally think the crew should know. That way the hay a chance to really try hard for your cash. But knowing and doing less will only result in another trip to guest services to complain about them and try and get them sacked for bad service. Treating guests with cash in their pockets less than because of removal would be shooting themselves in the foot. I also recommend splashing some cash on day one. It let's them know you roll cash in hand. I give my cabin attendant $40 when we meet and say just keep the clean towels coming. Bang we understand each other. Same in MDR. Also, know your schedule. If you won't be in MDR every night, tip as you go. It's an extra trip to run around last night with cash for everyone. Edited January 26 by CanHardlyWait Repeat post accident. TXcruzer and GJ_123 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanHardlyWait Posted January 26 Report Share Posted January 26 7 hours ago, ScottD said: Well, that's kinda sad but if that's what people prefer, then glad they can do it without being questioned. I'm also curious as to how service changes when this is done, as I believe room attendants and servers see who is and isn't pre-paid, but never did get confirmation on that You know you claimed to not want to tell people how to tip and then say this last ditch statement all people make in this argument. LOL. What would be the point of telling staff? Hopefully to try even harder for a cash tip. Not to give it bare minimum because an automatic gratuity isn't coming. To answer your question about being curious how service changes when this is done. It's been my experience that service stays exactly the same. If anything it improves. If anyone has concerns about service changing wait till 2 days before end of trip to have automatic gratuities removed. I personally think the crew should know. That way the hay a chance to really try hard for your cash. But knowing and doing less will only result in another trip to guest services to complain about them and try and get them sacked for bad service. Treating guests with cash in their pockets less than because of removal would be shooting themselves in the foot. I also recommend splashing some cash on day one. It let's them know you roll cash in hand. I give my cabin attendant $40 when we meet and say just keep the clean towels coming. Bang we understand each other. Same in MDR. Also, know your schedule. If you won't be in MDR every night, tip as you go. It's an extra trip to run around last night with cash for everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottD Posted January 26 Report Share Posted January 26 In the end they should just include it as part of the fare like other lines do. Mike.s and WAAAYTOOO 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanHardlyWait Posted January 26 Report Share Posted January 26 16 minutes ago, ScottD said: In the end they should just include it as part of the fare like other lines do. That might be fine for the rest of the crew, but cabin attendants and waitstaff (directly serving guests) have the opportunity to increase earnings based on performance. My take: You included in cruise fare and run the risk of mediocre performance by employees. That results in higher turnover due to the constant letting go of under performing staff. Firing, hiring, training, etc all costs money Royal is too cheap to put out. So they try to dump the expense of labor on the customer with the current system. Again, bring cash and tip directly. Don't not tip at all. Tipping daily saves time on last full day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXcruzer Posted January 27 Report Share Posted January 27 17 hours ago, ScottD said: In the end they should just include it as part of the fare like other lines do. With the exception of Virgin Voyages, name one direct competitor to Royal in the North American market that includes tips in the fare. Hint: There are none GJ_123 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXcruzer Posted January 27 Report Share Posted January 27 22 hours ago, CrimsonCruiser said: Adam Ruins Everything taught me that our(ie American) tipping custom actually dates back to gangsters and the like sliding extra money (aka bribery) to their servers for better service (and you know...to ignore the crimes happening probably). Then, when big bad bosses caught wind of this they figured..oh well why should I pay you when the customer is paying you?, so then they cut back on employees wages. Only that practice stayed even though most of us aren't gangsters, because cutting employee wages nicely lines the pockets of corporate. And corporate always cares about corporate first. So, tipping wasn't/isn't about - do good and you'll get some undisclosed amount of money. If anything it was, "here's some extra money, keep serving me better than you do the others and I'll give you more of what you're already seeing" So tipping up front and then adding more later...very classic way. Also, modern tipping, in my view, should be a sign of appreciation for someone going above and beyond the expected services. So like when my stateroom attendant made towel animals every night, or made sure to keep our suite stocked with large coffee cups, or when they chased down to find our missing luggage. Things outside of their normal duties that they do because they want to make my experience better than average. Anyway - here's the video. I think this is a clip from a longer show but i skimmed and it should talk about it and cite sources. "Adam Ruins Everything" really?? A satirical comedian is your argument? Sorry, in modern society (at least in the US) a gratuity is a reward for good service; it is something to strive to achieve. CanHardlyWait 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Posted January 27 Report Share Posted January 27 1 hour ago, TXcruzer said: Sorry, in modern society (at least in the US) a gratuity is a reward for good service; it is something to strive to achieve. Got to disagree with this as places in the US put the expected tip % onto reciepts without even knowing how customers feel about the service or the food/drink they have received. And if you tip lower due to poor service etc then they are not happy about it! Attiude of some is Level of service or quality of food doesn't matter just give me the 20% thats written on reciept! Ampurp85 and fireclan 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanHardlyWait Posted January 27 Report Share Posted January 27 2 hours ago, Ray said: Got to disagree with this as places in the US put the expected tip % onto reciepts without even knowing how customers feel about the service or the food/drink they have received. And if you tip lower due to poor service etc then they are not happy about it! Attiude of some is Level of service or quality of food doesn't matter just give me the 20% thats written on reciept! And if the service stinks you have two choices. Tip less or complain about the server to their employer. Big deal "they are not happy about it". The old rule of service was leave nothing but a quarter next to the bill on the table. That meant your service stunk. It was considered kinder than complaining to there employer. Basically giving them a heads up to improve before someone does complain. Nobody today knows this hack. Too old. Like me. LOL But to tip someone who did a poor job because it's expected is how this crazy tipping culture got out of hand in the first place. Nobody gets 20% from me for fear of "attitude". It's my attitude that must be feared. LOL. Ray and Keanoknick 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXcruzer Posted January 27 Report Share Posted January 27 3 hours ago, Ray said: Got to disagree with this as places in the US put the expected tip % onto reciepts without even knowing how customers feel about the service or the food/drink they have received. And if you tip lower due to poor service etc then they are not happy about it! Attiude of some is Level of service or quality of food doesn't matter just give me the 20% thats written on reciept! EXPECTED %, yes is listed; one always has the option to do as one sees fit. I could care less what they expect, they will get what I feel they have earned. Keanoknick and CanHardlyWait 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonCruiser Posted January 28 Report Share Posted January 28 On 1/27/2024 at 7:05 AM, TXcruzer said: "Adam Ruins Everything" really?? A satirical comedian is your argument? A comedian with sources that I can look into myself (though admittedly, the age of the video means one of the sources is now behind a paywall). But, here I fixed it: the Cornell university study cited both by Adam and in the New Yorker: " In an extensive survey of tipping studies, Michael Lynn, a professor at Cornell, found only a weak correlation between the quality of service that people report receiving and the tips they give. On average, exceptional service raised tips by about 1.5 percent" https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2005/09/05/check-please-3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GJ_123 Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 I read an article recently about a waitress in America who worked for a multi-national chain restaurant, and she posted a receipt online where the customers said in effect 'sorry we don't tip' and walked out. The customers were European and she obviously made some negative and angry comments about them. While the receipt thing is a bit mean and I obviously don't agree with it, I noticed many people commenting on it saying it's wild she is taking her anger out on the customer and not the multi-national company she works for, which clearly pays their staff unfairly while raking in huge profits. It's like the onus is on the customer to subsidise poor wages. It's exactly the same with RC. They pay their staff shockingly! Don't allow yourself to think any different. Like I mentioned before I feel like people are tricked/brainwashed into believing tipping excessively (daily gratuities, 18% on everything AND tipping in cash/adding to the receipt) is for some sort of greater good, like if this didn't happen RC would have to hike fares and they would have to pay more tax (poor Royal Caribbean, with their ships registered in the BAHAMAS they will barely pay any tax as it is). Trust me, you are kidding yourself. The people at the top of the company are probably laughing at how little they have to pay their staff, and how much their wages are subsidised by customers. ScottishRobbie, PeloAl and tingtang 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GJ_123 Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 On 1/27/2024 at 2:11 PM, Ray said: Got to disagree with this as places in the US put the expected tip % onto reciepts without even knowing how customers feel about the service or the food/drink they have received. And if you tip lower due to poor service etc then they are not happy about it! Attiude of some is Level of service or quality of food doesn't matter just give me the 20% thats written on reciept! Yeah that is insane. Having a pre-determined tipping amount is ridiculous. I wouldn't be surprised as well if your waiter is half hoping you leave something in cash, as well as the automatic gratuity? That means you are getting into 30-40% territory. The worst I have ever seen was in New York when I went to a place that added 25% I just paid it but funnily enough I heard someone complaining and they had it removed. It's just totally different cultures. I live in the UK and gratuities are basically never added to bills. The only instance I've seen this is if you are booking for a large party (6+ maybe) SOME restaurants will add a 10% service charge, but you can have it removed no questions asked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pattycruise Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 Weighing in -as if my opinion would matter to anyone Having worked as a server tips were always appreciated. Did everyone do them, no. I had regular customers who were regular tippers-you bet I went out of my way to take care of them. Having spoken with crew about where they are from and the choice they made to work on the ships I feel my "paltry additional tips" go a long way to help their families back home. A lot of crew try and get on the US based sailings because of the US tipping culture. I will continue to tip addtional-because I want to. If you choose not to, no judgement. I do think pulling tips because you feel Royal should pay a better wage only hurts the employee. I've recently met a staff member who is 10 years with Royal and she is very happy, my assumption would be it is better for her on the ship than it is back home. Perhaps next time I will do a more in depth conversation to ask the reason they stay with the company. I had a wonderful stateroom attendant who had 25 years with Royal. Seriously, if the working conditions are "that bad" and the pay "that bad" I do not think they would still be with the company. We are imposing our standards on others. I traveled to London and had service charges added onto our bill at 2 dining places. We were near the bus station area when this happened. I suppose I could argue that if they were paid enough they wouldn't be doing that or I could say they were taking advantage of foreigners. I won't. I thought it was interesting and did not feel the service charge was enough-so I added to the tip. More power to those who work in the service industry. Maggie M and WAAAYTOOO 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 9 hours ago, GJ_123 said: It's just totally different cultures. I live in the UK and gratuities are basically never added to bills. The only instance I've seen this is if you are booking for a large party (6+ maybe) SOME restaurants will add a 10% service charge, but you can have it removed no questions asked. Im uk as well and its happening over here also! Not sure if you use fast food but look at reciepts for " Service Charge" as long as they mention service charge be it on menu or website then its legal We are now being charged for people doing the job the are employed to do! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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