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Psycho and Barb

coronavirus causes quarantined cruise ship

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4 minutes ago, Zambia-Zaire said:

Not sure I follow...how am I extrapolating false information, when Dr. Tarling himself explain the reasoning behind pumping in fresh air versus just recycling air. Out of caution yes, because of their understanding of possible modes of transmitting...they didn't just reach that particular conclusion out of thin air...no pun intended. They obviously realize some of the methods employed may not have been fully adequate & made proper adjustments as the proceed along. The increase volume of fresh air ventilation is just one of those adjustment they made, that he stated they didn't employ initially; so, not sure why you feel I'm extrapolating anything from what he said.

Because you are stating it as fact.  it is not fact.  He is simply trying to show they are exceeding what they have been told is required to dispel fear from people trashing cruise ships on social media.  You yourself offered "major source of concern".  It's not a major source of concern, rather they made an adjustment just in case.  

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??? That is a major source if concern, when attempting reduce the volume of spread/infections, that is obviously serious enough that governments are closing off ports to some of the ships...reason why they made the adjustment for that procedure. I'm personally not faulting cruise lines...they are forced to house these passengers, the best they can; because, these countries are denying entry.

You seem to be implying I'm in the category of blaming cruise line for this circumstance...not sure how you're falsely extrapolating that opinion.

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There are many ways to transmit a virus. Droplet transmission in the air by cough or sneeze or simply talking. Body fluids via blood, urine, semen. Via vectors such as animals and insects. By infected food. Some virus can simply waif like smoke through the air from one open window into another. 

Some virus can withstand extreme heat and cold and can live on various surfaces for days.

These quarantined individuals do eat. It has been said they leave their rooms for brief walks on deck. Their food is being prepared by ships staff. This staff is working together is unknown groups exposing each other and perhaps everything they touch, including serving dishes and food, carts used for transportation and so on.

The details of corona virus and how it spreads does not seem to be known.

So many individuals confined to a relatively small space, in my mind, makes it inevitable that every susceptible individual will be infected sooner or later by some means if they stay confined.

The choices are:

Expose every one, take care of everyone as well as possible, let God sort them out. This is the expedient method.

Leave them in their current environment, trying to stay isolated, until the all become exposed anyway. Trying to stay isolated just prolongs the process on the slim hope some few will not become exposed. This is what was tried with more and more becoming infected every day it seems.

Get them all off the ship and quarantined in a better facility  where the spread can actually be controlled. In the process of moving a few thousand people you run the risk of exposing others during transport. This has been done with some people. Now ambulances, buses, airplanes and who knows what have been exposed and have to be decontaminated while hoping no one else is exposed in the process. The cost is enormous.

A virus can be insidious. It can live for a long time. It can lie dormant and resurface after years.

Its not a pretty picture.

 

 

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I agree Zambia-Zaire, for starters, as memory serves me, conditioned air is only fed into the cabins, there is no return vent to circulate air in individual cabins. That air makes its way from the cabin to the passageway, complete maybe with the virus, and then what ?!?

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2 hours ago, Jzx1103 said:

Well this probably answers the question as to why the Virus spreading was rampant on the Diamond Princess

Hmmm.  He may have some valid points but he isn't well liked within his own government it seems.  No one wanted him there and it seems someone was working hard to keep him away.  

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I know nothing about this man or his professional credentials, but as a Safety Engineer, I will say that all of his concerns and criticisms (if accurate) are sound.  If the ship, in fact, has/had not established effective green, red and yellow zones, there is no way to effectively control the spread of any contagion or stressor.

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This is a good example of taken the right decision and implement it wrongly.

I still think with the number of people you had on the ship it was the right decision to conduct the quarantine on the ship but they quarantine only the passengers ...  The crew was at quarantined at all.

To do it right they should have not going with the easy way of letting the same crew continue to prepare and serve the meals of the passengers while I think they should have brought the food from the outside and serve it by the quarantine team.  

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As a Paramedic, Nurse, Rescue Diver, Swift-water Rescue, HazMat Tech ...etc ... I have had some exposure to decontamination procedures and am familiar with the zoned (red, yellow, green) approach.

In my opinion, the entire ship was the red zone, Protective equipment/DeCon area would be the just out side the ship (the pier) with the green area outside that.(the street)

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12 minutes ago, Ditchdoc said:

As a Paramedic, Nurse, Rescue Diver, Swift-water Rescue, HazMat Tech ...etc ... I have had some exposure to decontamination procedures and am familiar with the zoned (red, yellow, green) approach.

In my opinion, the entire ship was the red zone, Protective equipment/DeCon area would be the just out side the ship (the pier) with the green area outside that.(the street)

Yes, apparently that was the case

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I would hope so.  We just finished our cruise the first part of February.  Had an appointment with my doctor and he suggested that I cancel our next three cruises.   He said this virus isn't going away any time soon.  We're still planning on going and taking our chances. 

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18 hours ago, Ditchdoc said:

Cruise line stocks fall after State Department urges citizens not to take cruises in Asia

 

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/cruise-line-stocks-fall-after-state-department-urges-citizens-not-to-take-cruises-in-asia-2020-02-21

Think RCCL is down 10%.

Marketwatch is being a bit click-bait-y here. The entire market worldwide is down over the fears being generated by this disease. I follow Apple (AAPL) closely since I have a decent amount of stock with them for retirement. As of right now, it's dropped from it's high of $327.85 (that was reached exactly one week ago) to $295.06 -- also a 10% drop.

I can't think of one big, multi-national company that doesn't have a strong dependency on China for manufacturing and assembly -- pretty much every electronics company, a bunch of clothing brands, machine parts suppliers, the list goes on. Most of those companies have boxed themselves in through their dependence on the high-scale manufacturing and assembly they all depend on from companies like Pegatron and Foxconn, with their city-sized assembly plants in the Shenzhen region and elsewhere in China. If China truly ends up getting ravaged by this disease as time goes on, there's going to be far worse drops in the stock market than what's happening from the cruise industry losing a bunch of ports of call.

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The DOW is down.  All stocks are taking a hit from this.  The stock market is driven by emotion more so than any other factor.  Logic and facts play a role but to a lesser degree.  

Look at the DOW index:

1049157153_DOW2-26-202025day.jpeg.c2792a1912eff90d21ceb939fe08e963.jpeg

Compare that to RCCL stock:

1348474602_RCCL5day2-20-2020.jpeg.a2d7a67f41c530572a842b19b6ad3e3a.jpeg

They both have trended downward, took a small cliff dive on Feb. 24 and then continued a down position since.  

Consequently you can take the market watch article, substitute almost any stock in place of RCCL and the article reads the same.  

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23 minutes ago, twangster said:

The DOW is down.  All stocks are taking a hit from this.  The stock market is driven by emotion more so than any other factor.

For me the only emotion is trying to figure out when to buy-in on this dip  🤑  The market has been at all-time highs for quite some time now!

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7 hours ago, AshleyDillo said:

For me the only emotion is trying to figure out when to buy-in on this dip  🤑  The market has been at all-time highs for quite some time now!

If it’s a company / stock you know well and have confidence in, just buy and then hold for the long term. Don’t worry about timing as long as you plan to hold as least 5 years AND it’s a company you follow and know well. Speaking from experience here, will leave it at that.

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I’m not saying that these corporations aren’t negatively impacted by the CV hysteria.  They certainly are - particularly those with manufacturing alliances with China BUT I also believe that the institutional traders are using this issue to manipulate a market that has been broadly oversold for some time.  I have never been more grateful to have gotten out of the market back in October of last year.

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