Catholic Mass On Board

[Jerry Altmann]

Presently sailing on Enchantment and just happened to look at Message Board and learned Catholic Mass was to be celebrated in the conference room. About 120 passengers showed up in an unprepared overcrowded room . We had to set up the chairs and accommodated everyone. It was a beautiful service conducted by two Archdiocese of Baltimore priests who we have socialized with since. We then had a second Sunday mass in the Spotlight Lounge that was attended by about two hundred passengers. The ship would not put a posting in the Cruise Compass saying it was against company policy so the message board and word of mouth was all that was used to announce the event. Curiously, the ship did post in the cruise compass an announcement for Jewish Sabbath Observance-self guided. It also posted for LGBT get togethers daily.  We are Pinnacles and this is the first time in about 30 cruises that we have had Catholic Mass on board. Apparently, Royal Caribbean does not foster having priests on board to say Mass and we saw this first hand. What a mistake!

[Xaa]

Jerry, this is a fan site, not Royal Caribbean.

I recognize the issue with having the Jewish Sabbath Observance in the compass but not the Catholic Mass as both are religeous gatherings.  The LGBT Get tTogethers are not religion based so I don't see the connection there.

[DonR]

Perhaps this was not a prearranged or Royal Caribbean arranged meeting. I know if you look at the Cruise Compasses for Radiance recently you will find Morning Mass listed Daily. While I have not seen this on other ships I presume the Priest whose name is listed in the compass is actually a crew member. 

[Riley]

I see Sabbath and Mass postings on the Cruise Compass on a regular basis so I think DonR may be correct.

[tjcruisers]

On our last cruise they had a priest who was travelling and offered to do mass. It was in the cruise compass from what I remember. Having said that I would think having it on the message board should be sufficient.

[BennyandBo]

4 hours ago, Jerry Altmann said:

Presently sailing on Enchantment and just happened to look at Message Board and learned Catholic Mass was to be celebrated in the conference room. About 120 passengers showed up in an unprepared overcrowded room . We had to set up the chairs and accommodated everyone. It was a beautiful service conducted by two Archdiocese of Baltimore priests who we have socialized with since. We then had a second Sunday mass in the Spotlight Lounge that was attended by about two hundred passengers. The ship would not put a posting in the Cruise Compass saying it was against company policy so the message board and word of mouth was all that was used to announce the event. Curiously, the ship did post in the cruise compass an announcement for Jewish Sabbath Observance-self guided. It also posted for LGBT get togethers daily.  We are Pinnacles and this is the first time in about 30 cruises that we have had Catholic Mass on board. Apparently, Royal Caribbean does not foster having priests on board to say Mass and we saw this first hand. What a mistake!

I have to go with Xaa on this. I don't see the relevance of bringing up LGBT get together's. Comparing Catholic and Jewish yes. They are both religions. 

Frankly I don't want anyone advertising a religion in my face ever, let alone on my vacation. It's not just Royal Caribbean, I "don't foster having priests on board to say Mass" as well. But I could care less if others do. Just don't advertise it. Maybe now you see why a large company like RoyalCaribbean carefully walks a line on advertising religion on board. 

[tjcruisers]

34 minutes ago, BennyandBo said:

Maybe now you see why a large company like RoyalCaribbean carefully walks a line on advertising religion on board. 

Yep. I should have also mentioned that while on my last cruise that had it, during the captain Q&A the priest thanked the captain for allowing him to do it and the captain thanked the priest for doing it. At that point many hands went up complaining why nothing was done for their religion (ended up highjacking the Q&A).

[drjohn4]

6 hours ago, Jerry Altmann said:

Presently sailing on Enchantment and just happened to look at Message Board and learned Catholic Mass was to be celebrated in the conference room. About 120 passengers showed up in an unprepared overcrowded room . We had to set up the chairs and accommodated everyone. It was a beautiful service conducted by two Archdiocese of Baltimore priests who we have socialized with since. We then had a second Sunday mass in the Spotlight Lounge that was attended by about two hundred passengers. The ship would not put a posting in the Cruise Compass saying it was against company policy so the message board and word of mouth was all that was used to announce the event. Curiously, the ship did post in the cruise compass an announcement for Jewish Sabbath Observance-self guided. It also posted for LGBT get togethers daily.  We are Pinnacles and this is the first time in about 30 cruises that we have had Catholic Mass on board. Apparently, Royal Caribbean does not foster having priests on board to say Mass and we saw this first hand. What a mistake!

What message board did you find this on? Was it one on the ship?  FYI - Royal does not seem to be anti-catholic, the FAQ on religious services does say "A Priest will also offer a daily mass if there is a priest onboard. We are not able to guarantee that a priest is onboard for all our sailings, but we do try to book Priests for our Christmas and Easter sailings, and on repositioning sailings. These are subject to the cancellation of a Priest during the holiday periods." 

Based on your description of the attendance at mass, maybe they were worried about being able to find a large enough venue if it were more widely publicized.

https://www.royalcaribbean.com/faq/questions/does-royal-caribbean-offer-religious-services-onboard

[Atlantix2000]

14 minutes ago, drjohn4 said:

What message board did you find this on? Was it one on the ship?

There is usually a message board near Guest Services.  Anyone can add an index card with info.  Things like "Chicago Bears Fans meetup in Playmakers at 3PM" or "Friends of Bill W meeting in <location>" (that's an AA meeting if you didn't know), etc.

[AandD]

54 minutes ago, Atlantix2000 said:

There is usually a message board near Guest Services.  Anyone can add an index card with info.  Things like "Chicago Bears Fans meetup in Playmakers at 3PM" or "Friends of Bill W meeting in <location>" (that's an AA meeting if you didn't know), etc.

We used to see the message board before covid but not since. I wonder if this is now on just some of the ships. 

 

[teddy]

Back in October on Voyager, there was a board in the library with guest led events posted. 

[Larry Muster]

Since there seems to be no guarantee there will be a priest on board, does that mean true hardcore catholics can't cruise over a weekend?  

[Xaa]

22 minutes ago, Larry Muster said:

Since there seems to be no guarantee there will be a priest on board, does that mean true hardcore catholics can't cruise over a weekend?  

I think as long as when they return they go to confession before taking the eucharist, they're all good.

[USFFrank]

3 hours ago, Larry Muster said:

Since there seems to be no guarantee there will be a priest on board, does that mean true hardcore catholics can't cruise over a weekend?  

It's just as easy to (providing you have an internet package) stream any kind of Religious service on Facebook live, or YouTube whenever convenient.

[drjohn4]

5 hours ago, Larry Muster said:

Since there seems to be no guarantee there will be a priest on board, does that mean true hardcore catholics can't cruise over a weekend?  

A faithful Catholic should try to find a way to attend mass when possible.  We have gone to mass in ports of call before.  It is one of the neat things about travel to experience mass in different cultures.  (The music at a mass we went to in Nassau was particularly memorable.)  The Catechism of the Catholic Church recognizes that there are times when attending mass is not possible and recommends "If because of lack of a sacred minister or for other grave cause participation in the celebration of the Eucharist is impossible, it is specially recommended that the faithful take part in the Liturgy of the Word if it is celebrated in the parish church or in another sacred place according to the prescriptions of the diocesan bishop, or engage in prayer for an appropriate amount of time personally or in a family or, as occasion offers, in groups of families." (CCC 2183)  

As to deciding if a Catholic should avoid making vacation plans that would preclude the possibility of attending mass, some might recommend discussing your specific circumstances with your pastor and seeking dispensation from the obligation to attend mass on a particular Sunday if needed.

[Larry Muster]

On 1/25/2023 at 10:18 AM, USFFrank said:

It's just as easy to (providing you have an internet package) stream any kind of Religious service on Facebook live, or YouTube whenever convenient.

I don't think that's going to cut it.  It appears the Catholics have a pretty firm stance that online service will not cut it.  Below is what I found supporting this.  The reason for all this - I'm hoping to bring my nephews on a cruise, but their mother is hardcore Catholic and does not bend.  Trying to figure out how I can position this to increase the possibility of being able to bring them.

 

The short answer is "no." The Church requires us to attend Mass, in person, on all Holy Days of Obligation and Sundays. Individually viewing the Mass will never substitute for this encounter with the Lord Jesus Christ. Attendance at Mass is also commanded by the Third Commandment. This is commanded by Jesus in two distinct places.

[USFFrank]

4 hours ago, Larry Muster said:

I don't think that's going to cut it.  It appears the Catholics have a pretty firm stance that online service will not cut it.  Below is what I found supporting this.  The reason for all this - I'm hoping to bring my nephews on a cruise, but their mother is hardcore Catholic and does not bend.  Trying to figure out how I can position this to increase the possibility of being able to bring them.

 

The short answer is "no." The Church requires us to attend Mass, in person, on all Holy Days of Obligation and Sundays. Individually viewing the Mass will never substitute for this encounter with the Lord Jesus Christ. Attendance at Mass is also commanded by the Third Commandment. This is commanded by Jesus in two distinct places.

Looks like you'll have to go on a cruise that's less than 7 days and doesn't fall on a Sunday. I'm Catholic, but not hardcore. I attend Mass every week, and in the rare event when I cannot, my Church streams one of their Sunday Masses on YouTube. I know, to each his own.  

[drjohn4]

2 hours ago, USFFrank said:

Looks like you'll have to go on a cruise that's less than 7 days and doesn't fall on a Sunday. I'm Catholic, but not hardcore. I attend Mass every week, and in the rare event when I cannot, my Church streams one of their Sunday Masses on YouTube. I know, to each his own.  

Actually much easier than that. Any Sunday departure will work. Just go to the Saturday evening mass the day prior to boarding and a Sunday afternoon or evening mass when you return. 

[Riley]

On 1/28/2023 at 3:05 PM, Larry Muster said:

I don't think that's going to cut it.  It appears the Catholics have a pretty firm stance that online service will not cut it.  Below is what I found supporting this.  The reason for all this - I'm hoping to bring my nephews on a cruise, but their mother is hardcore Catholic and does not bend.  Trying to figure out how I can position this to increase the possibility of being able to bring them.

 

The short answer is "no." The Church requires us to attend Mass, in person, on all Holy Days of Obligation and Sundays. Individually viewing the Mass will never substitute for this encounter with the Lord Jesus Christ. Attendance at Mass is also commanded by the Third Commandment. This is commanded by Jesus in two distinct places.

There is 50+ year precedent I can personally attest to that viewing a mass when one cannot attend in person is acceptable within doctrine. 

Local TV stations in both my home and current city offer televised mass, both Sundays and on select Holy Days. The concept (which used to be called "Mass for Shut Ins") was implemented as TVs became commonly available and the number of available priests to visit shut-ins dropped. Yes, in-person Mass is the obligation but so is attending confession every single Saturday before attending Mass on Sunday. So is fasting during Lent. So are a lot of other obligations the Catholic Church allows a little leeway on. 

[PeggyG]

Trying to confirm there will be an Easter mass on April 8 or 9, 2023 on the adventures of the sea. 

[USFFrank]

3 hours ago, PeggyG said:

Trying to confirm there will be an Easter mass on April 8 or 9, 2023 on the adventures of the sea. 

 There really is no way to actually know if there will be one until you are on the ship. I was on Adventure of the Seas embarking on Easter Sunday in 2019. I had gotten up at 6:00AM in order to go to the 7:00AM mass at my local Church that morning. Later on that morning we drove from Orlando to Ft. Lauderdale to get on the ship. I saw a listing in the cruise planner for a Catholic Easter service at 11:00PM that night in the Lyric Theater. There was a Priest on board this cruise who also celebrated daily Masses (at the Imperial Lounge) the rest of the week. I attended that Easter service as well. There were also crew members in attendance too. This 11:00PM service was following the adults only comedian show. I remember the comedian talking about what was to follow his show and lightly poking fun at it. 

 Now getting back to my original thought, had I known there was going to be an Easter Mass onboard I wouldn't have gotten up at 6:00AM to go to my Church. All you can do is check your cruise planner. 

[stevendom57]

I wonder if RC gives special rates (or a free cruise) to a priest if they agree to perform mass.

[Vancity Cruiser]

14 hours ago, stevendom57 said:

I wonder if RC gives special rates (or a free cruise) to a priest if they agree to perform mass.

Not likely. The percentage of people looking to attend mass on a cruise ship is too small. A previous poster mentioned 200 people attending a mass on enchantment, that is less than 1% of passengers.

[Poolside]

24 minutes ago, Vancity Cruiser said:

Not likely. The percentage of people looking to attend mass on a cruise ship is too small. A previous poster mentioned 200 people attending a mass on enchantment, that is less than 1% of passengers.

Closer to 10%. There are not 20,000 passengers on Enchantment. 

[Xaa]

37 minutes ago, Vancity Cruiser said:

Not likely. The percentage of people looking to attend mass on a cruise ship is too small. A previous poster mentioned 200 people attending a mass on enchantment, that is less than 1% of passengers.

Like @Poolsidesaid, way more than 1%.  I think the reason they wouldn't though is because there are too many religions.  If they start paying for a priest, where does it end?  Do they then need to do it for all religions, even those that some of us might consider to be on the fringe?  It's not hard to start a religion and become ordained.

[AandD]

22 minutes ago, Xaa said:

Like @Poolsidesaid, way more than 1%.  I think the reason they wouldn't though is because there are too many religions.  If they start paying for a priest, where does it end?  Do they then need to do it for all religions, even those that some of us might consider to be on the fringe?  It's not hard to start a religion and become ordained.

We are just happy that Royal has given us a space to hold a service when we have travelled with our priest.

[TXcruzer]

23 hours ago, PeggyG said:

Trying to confirm there will be an Easter mass on April 8 or 9, 2023 on the adventures of the sea. 

You will never get a confirmation pre cruise

[TXcruzer]

On 1/28/2023 at 3:05 PM, Larry Muster said:

I don't think that's going to cut it.  It appears the Catholics have a pretty firm stance that online service will not cut it.  Below is what I found supporting this.  The reason for all this - I'm hoping to bring my nephews on a cruise, but their mother is hardcore Catholic and does not bend.  Trying to figure out how I can position this to increase the possibility of being able to bring them.

 

The short answer is "no." The Church requires us to attend Mass, in person, on all Holy Days of Obligation and Sundays. Individually viewing the Mass will never substitute for this encounter with the Lord Jesus Christ. Attendance at Mass is also commanded by the Third Commandment. This is commanded by Jesus in two distinct places.

The official stance of the church is to participate in mass "when one can reasonably attend".  My priest said if there is no mass onboard, you can not "reasonably attend".  Online service or even just a quiet moment of personal reflection is perfectly fine.

[Debgum]

We are planning our first RC cruise. Is there any way we can find out beforehand if there’s a Catholic Mass available? 

[wordell1]

8 hours ago, Debgum said:

We are planning our first RC cruise. Is there any way we can find out beforehand if there’s a Catholic Mass available? 

As answered above, there is no way to know.  I wouldn't expect it.

[drjohn4]

We sailed out of Galveston on a Sunday and dropped our bags off at the terminal, then had the driver drop us of at Sacred Heart Catholic Church which is about 1 mile from the terminal for the 11 AM mass.  The church is beautiful and we walked back to the port to board after mass.  It worked out great.  

[ScottD]

On 1/28/2023 at 4:05 PM, Larry Muster said:

 

 

The short answer is "no." The Church requires us to attend Mass, in person, on all Holy Days of Obligation and Sundays. Individually viewing the Mass will never substitute for this encounter with the Lord Jesus Christ. Attendance at Mass is also commanded by the Third Commandment. This is commanded by Jesus in two distinct places.

Well I mean, there was no zoom when Jesus brought this up.  I'm no longer a practicing Catholic, but I know my mom is hardcore and her priests were fine with her joining in online during covid and when she is too sick to attend and even when she leaves town to visit family.  I think the attempt to participate is now a pretty accepted practice, as they know attendance in person is dwindling for various reasons, and most priests and parishes will be happy to know you made the attempt to attend no matter where or how it is done. 

[Pooch]

All of that is true but, for a devout Catholic, physical attendance at Sunday Mass is a requirement except for exceptional circumstances.  Vacation would not qualify as such a circumstance.  Not making judgments either way, just pointing out.  Does any other religion have this requirement?

[CruiseRoyalDad]

On 1/25/2023 at 7:04 AM, Xaa said:

I think as long as when they return they go to confession before taking the eucharist, they're all good.

@Xaa is wrong and seems to know little about the Catholic church. @Larry Muster see @drjohn4 response for the correct answer. Thank you @drjohn4. 

[CruiseRoyalDad]

2 hours ago, Pooch said:

All of that is true but, for a devout Catholic, physical attendance at Sunday Mass is a requirement except for exceptional circumstances.  Vacation would not qualify as such a circumstance.  Not making judgments either way, just pointing out.  Does any other religion have this requirement?

Hey @Pooch I very much agree with you. But the situation is outlined perfectly in @drjohn4 response. If you are on a Saturday to Saturday cruise you are pretty much sure you're going to miss mass Saturday night as the earliest vigils are at 4pm. Trying to make it to a 4:30pm all aboard won't happen. While great, and while this sometimes is the case, there will be NO expectation to have a priest onboard for Sunday. Discussing this with the most conservative of pastors many are very much willing to provide a special dispensation which may include (but not limited to) a direction to engage in prayer and reflection. Now, if you are told in no uncertain terms by your pastor that a dispensation will not be granted and you choose to go on a cruise and miss mass anyway then yes, at that point @Xaa would be correct in that it's a mortal sin and you'd have to go to confession before receiving the Eucharist which we know as Catholics is not a symbol, but the actual Savior in physical form. 

Here's some personal experience with the matter. I was on a run once with Father Sutter, an former Army Ranger and superb priest of a more liberal parish in Charlotte, St Gabriel. He basically told me I need to always prioritize the Eucharist and I should have picked my dates better. I couldn't agree more with him and am very much thankful for his ministry. This was a few years back. My parents on that same cruise however, thought ahead and went to a super conservative priest at St. Patrick's Charlotte, he asked them to do a rosary and one for him and gladly granted them dispensation for that Sunday they would miss.

The last time I went on a cruise, I honestly sat on the Suite's beach in Labadee, where the water meets the sand, with my steel rosary in hand (sandy and wet) praying while looking at God's beautiful scenery, realizing the absolute blessing I have that so many don't, and being thankful for time to spend with family. 

So the reasons for all of the red tape, dispensations, and the such is to ensure that we as the faithful keep the Sacred Heart of Jesus in mind at all times. That we realize that God never takes a day off from us and we should endeavor to never take a day off from Him, though we do often and we fail often. 

Taking the OP in good faith he seemed to be mad that they had a priest onboard, had other religious or societal religious adjacent social activities advertised in the cruise compass, but would not advertise mass even though the capability was there for it to occur. I have ZERO expectation that priest will cruise with us but if he did I would hope that a time and location would be posted like the Sabbath service almost always is on all cruises. I do think that I've seen cruise compasses in the past advertise mass when available so I'm chalking this up to a one off. Duck off a waters back. 

I've given this much thought because we leave on HOS Saturday August 5th out of Miami. So we are currently in this exact situation. I can find a priest willing to tag along and pay the cruise fare or ask for a dispensation which is hopefully granted. 

Cruise Safe and God Bless!!! 

[Xaa]

34 minutes ago, CruiseRoyalDad said:

@Xaa is wrong and seems to know little about the Catholic church.

That's maybe a little harsh.  I am Catholic.  Not hardcore.

If not showing up is a sin and I go for confession and confess it, do my penance then how is it not all good to the point where you declare it both wrong and to such a degree that it means one knows little about the church?  I'm asking seriously.  I'm under the belief that reconciliation is how I become whole with the church again.

[CruiseRoyalDad]

2 minutes ago, Xaa said:

That's maybe a little harsh.  I am Catholic.  Not hardcore.

If not showing up is a sin and I go for confession and confess it, do my penance then how is it not all good to the point where you declare it both wrong and to such a degree that it means one knows little about the church?  I'm asking seriously.  I'm under the belief that reconciliation is how I become whole with the church again.

I was harsh and quick to anger. Partly the nature of the response and the funny enough "this is a fan site" comment always sets me off. Yes it's a fan site but as fans part of the education is talking about what we perceive as good and bad at Royal. But I digress, and my apologies for being so ill-tempered. I actually, ended up pointing out how you were correct in a follow-on post.

In reflection you were actually very right with your answer but I imposed a tone of being flippant on your post when reading it my head. My problem not yours. To know grave sin, in this case missing mass, commit it, then go to confession with expectation of forgiveness is not ideal and can be a sin in it of itself. Yet I've done it too many times to count. 

Confession and reconciliation is exactly how you get right and become whole again.

Jump on the the HOS august 5th and I'll buy you a drink in Central Park, we can talk more! 

[Pooch]

29 minutes ago, CruiseRoyalDad said:

Hey @Pooch I very much agree with you. But the situation is outlined perfectly in @drjohn4 response. If you are on a Saturday to Saturday cruise you are pretty much sure you're going to miss mass Saturday night as the earliest vigils are at 4pm. Trying to make it to a 4:30pm all aboard won't happen. While great, and while this sometimes is the case, there will be NO expectation to have a priest onboard for Sunday. Discussing this with the most conservative of pastors many are very much willing to provide a special dispensation which may include (but not limited to) a direction to engage in prayer and reflection. Now, if you are told in no uncertain terms by your pastor that a dispensation will not be granted and you choose to go on a cruise and miss mass anyway then yes, at that point @Xaa would be correct in that it's a mortal sin and you'd have to go to confession before receiving the Eucharist which we know as Catholics is not a symbol, but the actual Savior in physical form. 

Here's some personal experience with the matter. I was on a run once with Father Sutter, an former Army Ranger and superb priest of a more liberal parish in Charlotte, St Gabriel. He basically told me I need to always prioritize the Eucharist and I should have picked my dates better. I couldn't agree more with him and am very much thankful for his ministry. This was a few years back. My parents on that same cruise however, thought ahead and went to a super conservative priest at St. Patrick's Charlotte, he asked them to do a rosary and one for him and gladly granted them dispensation for that Sunday they would miss.

The last time I went on a cruise, I honestly sat on the Suite's beach in Labadee, where the water meets the sand, with my steel rosary in hand (sandy and wet) praying while looking at God's beautiful scenery, realizing the absolute blessing I have that so many don't, and being thankful for time to spend with family. 

So the reasons for all of the red tape, dispensations, and the such is to ensure that we as the faithful keep the Sacred Heart of Jesus in mind at all times. That we realize that God never takes a day off from us and we should endeavor to never take a day off from Him, though we do often and we fail often. 

Taking the OP in good faith he seemed to be mad that they had a priest onboard, had other religious or societal religious adjacent social activities advertised in the cruise compass, but would not advertise mass even though the capability was there for it to occur. I have ZERO expectation that priest will cruise with us but if he did I would hope that a time and location would be posted like the Sabbath service almost always is on all cruises. I do think that I've seen cruise compasses in the past advertise mass when available so I'm chalking this up to a one off. Duck off a waters back. 

I've given this much thought because we leave on HOS Saturday August 5th out of Miami. So we are currently in this exact situation. I can find a priest willing to tag along and pay the cruise fare or ask for a dispensation which is hopefully granted. 

Cruise Safe and God Bless!!! 

I agree with your assessment.  My response was to state doctrine.  I know that most clergy will say go, keep God in your heart and enjoy yourself but OP said his sister was “hardcore”.  My Catholic faith tells me be the best Catholic I can.  Love God and my fellow man, attend Mass and understand sometimes stuff happens.  God loves me anyway!

[Vancity Cruiser]

3 hours ago, Pooch said:

Does any other religion have this requirement?

I grew up in a 'hyper-calvinistic' Christian home (extra credit if you know what this means) that was super heavy on legalistic rules. To this day, like many of the posters on this thread, my parents will avoid any vacation or activity that will not allow them to attend a church service from their specific denomination.

[Xaa]

Thanks @CruiseRoyalDad.  Would love to join you on HOS.  Would it be a sin if I told my wife that God asked it of me?