Internet speed, tethering, hot spot

[_1stTimer]

Is it possible to get the one-device internet package and just create a hot spot to share your connection? I'm sure it would be slow, but I wonder if 2 people could watch Netflix at the same time.

[Matt]

No. 

Besides the fact you're trying to circumvent the internet packages (1 package for 1 device but using it with 2 devices at same time), your device would need 2 wifi antennas to technically work.

Phones only have 1 wifi antenna.

[knewby]

When i was on Oasis in March, I purchased one device surf+stream, and was able to hotspot (using galaxy note 10+) it to multiple devices ( 2 kindle fires and my wife's iphone ), and the speed didn't seem to be impacted.  Kids could watch youtube and my wife could netflix without issue.  Obviously there were times when it was slow and unusable, but expected when you're in the middle of the ocean.

[Brett_FL]

  There was a portable devise /router at one time for doing this but it has been several years ago. Was advertised as being able to have one Wi-Fi connection to the hotel Wi-Fi and use multiple connections on the one account.    I think your main connection had to be with a laptop though and not a phone    is probably would not work in a cruise ship scenario though, since you are moving around and not just in one room  

 

 

 

 

[twangster]

Some phones were capable of hot spotting a WiFi connection but it's getting less common to see it.  Most only hotshot the celullar connection.

iPhones have blocked wifi sharing as a feature since forever.  Certain Samsung Galaxy phones had this as a capability but even Samsung has pulled back, or in some cases the carriers involved are preventing it from occurring.  I had an old Galaxy S7 with this capability but AT&T made it difficult to activate each time.  It required having a cellular connection to AT&T to enable the feature.  This call-home type activation was a problem on board since I didn't want my phone using the on board cell tower costing me hundreds so I could activate hotspot wifi sharing of the wifi.  Turning on cellular even briefly was exactly what I was trying to avoid - more charges. 

I ended up giving on the idea.

The other problem for streaming two devices at the same time is that Royal caps each user account typically below 4Mbs.  Two users sharing one account would have to share that 4Mbps so you'd have two streams struggling to load the content.  With a two device plan each device gets it's own 4Mbps connection which is sort of the minimum needed to stream without constant buffering and breaking up. 

A final problem is that users have to be in close proximity.  As soon as one person goes somewhere the other person loses their internet. 

Royal started to actively scan for networking sharing routers and would drop their connection if they found one.  You could reset it and get another few minutes but it was a cat and mouse game that got old quick when on vacation.  

I've tried using various routers and other tricks but it always came down to spending hours fiddling to try to get it work when they are taking steps to make sure it doesn't work.  It simply wasn't worth the precious vacation time to be constantly diddling with it.

Netflix lets me download content locally so the best solution would be to log in one device, download a show and then let another user log in on their device to download their show.  Even better would be to download content before getting on board because it is slow internet on ships, nothing like the gigabit internet I have at home. 

[_1stTimer]

I don't plan to violate the rule if it is indeed possible to do.

However, I just turned off cellular on my S22 and was able to create a Hotspot for a 2nd device using my home wifi connection. The 2nd device connected and had internet access with its cellular data off. There's also the bluetooth tethering option.

@Matt, speaking of the rules...I saw advice from people saying rather than getting a package for each guest in your party, you can just get multiple devices on one package. Isn't each guest supposed to have their own package and apply the extra device access to their own extra devices?

@twangster, the issue of splitting the bandwith between the 2 devices could be enough of a reason for RC not to even care if someone does it. Even though they sell them by pkg/device, they're really selling their total bandwidth parceled out by number of devices @ 4mb each (whether tethering or not). Edit: I'm surprised they made it so difficult, but I guess they view it as lost potential revenue even though it's not affecting bandwidth much.

Edited November 28, 2022 by _1stTimer

[twangster]

28 minutes ago, _1stTimer said:

I don't plan to violate the rule if it is indeed possible to do.

However, I just turned off cellular on my S22 and was able to create a Hotspot for a 2nd device using my home wifi connection. The 2nd device connected and had internet access with its cellular data off. There's also the bluetooth tethering option.

@Matt, speaking of the rules...I saw advice from people saying rather than getting a package for each guest in your party, you can just get multiple devices on one package. Isn't each guest supposed to have their own package and apply the extra device access to their own extra devices?

@twangster, the issue of splitting the bandwith between the 2 devices could be enough of a reason for RC not to even care if someone does it. Even though they sell them by pkg/device, they're really selling their total bandwidth parceled out by number of devices @ 4mb each (whether tethering or not).

My S22U will only hotspot cellular.  Tried just now. 

[Xaa]

28 minutes ago, _1stTimer said:

I don't plan to violate the rule if it is indeed possible to do.

However, I just turned off cellular on my S22 and was able to create a Hotspot for a 2nd device using my home wifi connection. The 2nd device connected and had internet access with its cellular data off. There's also the bluetooth tethering option.

@Matt, speaking of the rules...I saw advice from people saying rather than getting a package for each guest in your party, you can just get multiple devices on one package. Isn't each guest supposed to have their own package and apply the extra device access to their own extra devices?

@twangster, the issue of splitting the bandwith between the 2 devices could be enough of a reason for RC not to even care if someone does it. Even though they sell them by pkg/device, they're really selling their total bandwidth parceled out by number of devices @ 4mb each (whether tethering or not).

I think you're nitpicking @_1stTimer.  There is a difference between buying a plan for 2 devices and only every having 2 devices logged in than buying a one device plan and portioning it out yourself to devices.  I personally don't care what you do, but I would just both watch the same show in Netflix and snuggle up if the cost of the second device wasn't palatable.

[Swar]

My wife and I tether her Android phone to my computer all the time, while in the room or at a table. Speed is ok most of the time, even while we are both streaming. I use a VPN when I'm on my D+ days and it lets me stream fairly well even though I only have SURF. I also have cruise long SURF and STREAM by being a Signature member so am "authorized" 2 devices most days. I tether mostly because the 2 devices I'm authorized keep knocking one of us off if one of the devices is a computer.

[twangster]

The first rule of fight club is...

[_1stTimer]

1 hour ago, Xaa said:

I think you're nitpicking @_1stTimer.  There is a difference between buying a plan for 2 devices and only every having 2 devices logged in than buying a one device plan and portioning it out yourself to devices.  I personally don't care what you do, but I would just both watch the same show in Netflix and snuggle up if the cost of the second device wasn't palatable.

Maybe so. I'm spending over $300 on internet for our cruise, which in my opinion should be considered ludicrous by everyone, no matter what your budget is.

[twangster]

1 hour ago, _1stTimer said:

Maybe so. I'm spending over $300 on internet for our cruise, which in my opinion should be considered ludicrous by everyone, no matter what your budget is.

Over a number of years I've spent over $4k on Voom.  

While I understand where you may be coming from I not sure you understand the cost of industrial grade satellite based internet that concentrates several beams to aggregate bandwidth so that thousands of folks like you and me can watch Netflix on a ship in the middle of an ocean.  

Still a lot cheaper than some airlines that charge $10 per hour or more.  

[_1stTimer]

52 minutes ago, twangster said:

Over a number of years I've spent over $4k on Voom.  

While I understand where you may be coming from I not sure you understand the cost of industrial grade satellite based internet that concentrates several beams to aggregate bandwidth so that thousands of folks like you and me can watch Netflix on a ship in the middle of an ocean.  

Still a lot cheaper than some airlines that charge $10 per hour or more.  

@twangster, how much DOES it cost RC? Yah, it's cool we can access the internet from sea but heck why not $100 per day or $1,000 per day? Are we really getting a good deal?

[BigKarl]

I work as a Computer Analyst five days a week. I play multiple online video games on my PC most every night.  When I cruise I leave all Electronic devices at home. Yes, even my Iphone but excluding my Insulin pump which I need to take so that I can compensate for all of those desserts I am not supposed to eat. 

[twangster]

11 hours ago, _1stTimer said:

@twangster, how much DOES it cost RC? Yah, it's cool we can access the internet from sea but heck why not $100 per day or $1,000 per day? Are we really getting a good deal?

Across the fleet it was multiple millions before the shutdown.  

Heck even SpaceX used to use VSAT on their own vessels until they could do Starlink at Sea earlier this year.  VSAT is cheaper than O3b.  When SpaceX switched their costs went down 70%.

It costs millions to create one satellite and millions more to launch it on a rocket.  Times that by seven to make a constellation and is just the initial cost to get it into orbit.  Then you need a control center full of high priced talent to keep it there and run it.  Satellite anything is not cheap.   

[Blur]

I thought the same regarding not being able to hotspot a Wi-Fi source until I tried it on my pixel phone.  It worked really well.

[_1stTimer]

 @Xaa, you are virtue signaling and ignoring that I explicitly stated I do not plan to circumvent. Obviously people can go elsewhere. The main reason for buying intenet is for safety/communication with my kids. I read horrible reviews of the RC app for chatting. If there's something someone questions about a service or charge onboard can they not discuss it here? If you don't like discussing the subject of internet cost maybe just move on to the next thread?

------------

Interesting article about O3b which RC used (or still uses)? RC doesn't have to pay for their satellites or their rockets. Not sure what they pay to O3b.

Anyone know which ships are using Starlink now? "SpaceX unveiled Starlink Maritime for boats at a cost of $5,000 per month, on top of a hardware investment of $10,000."

I'll make some possibly conservative assumptions here... let's say 5,000 passengers on a ship and 10% of passengers get internet for one device on a 7-day cruise, so 500 x 7 x $23 = $80,500 for one cruise. 3 cruises in a month = $241,500. Cut that in half if my assumptions are off, and they've still covered the monthly Starlink fee and hardware, and made a fat profit.

[Matt]

16 hours ago, _1stTimer said:

@Matt, speaking of the rules...I saw advice from people saying rather than getting a package for each guest in your party, you can just get multiple devices on one package. Isn't each guest supposed to have their own package and apply the extra device access to their own extra devices?

No, internet packages can be shared between people. It's just the drink packages that cannot be shared.

[BrianB]

How about we all chip in and lease our own satellite constellation. The 'Royal Caribbean Blog Super Special Satellite Service' for members only?

[Xaa]

9 hours ago, _1stTimer said:

 @Xaa, you are virtue signaling and ignoring that I explicitly stated I do not plan to circumvent. Obviously people can go elsewhere. The main reason for buying intenet is for safety/communication with my kids. I read horrible reviews of the RC app for chatting. If there's something someone questions about a service or charge onboard can they not discuss it here? If you don't like discussing the subject of internet cost maybe just move on to the next thread?

 

Sorry for the confusion about your intention to have internet for safety, I was moved by your initial post wondering if 2 people could watch Netflix at the same time.  I should have known it was to watch safety videos.

Did you explicitly state that you didn't intend to circumvent or did you say "I don't plan to violate the rule if it is indeed possible to do.".  Circumventing isn't the same and maybe you don't even plan to do that.  What I was trying to say in the since moderator deleted post was that internet costs what it costs and you aren't a victim of that cost.  You have choices.   If you've already paid $300 for internet but want usage that might cost a little less than double that, then you have a choice.  It's your choice.  I would make mine, but not think any less of you regardless of yours. 

Call it virtue signaling (I seriously had to look it up) if you want, but there might be other similar examples where I might choose circumvention and you may not.  I'm not trying to pretend that I'm a saint.  I'm not really close.  I might be on the borderline for the whole admittance into heaven thing.

 

[_1stTimer]

26 minutes ago, Xaa said:

Sorry for the confusion about your intention to have internet for safety, I was moved by your initial post wondering if 2 people could watch Netflix at the same time.  I should have known it was to watch safety videos...

Safety videos! Hahaha. I won't take offense to the sarcasm because that's pretty funny. I think we can all enjoy the subject of internet cost and capabilities. I appreciate hearing all the opinions and experiences. Thanks for your opinion that I should not express an opinion about the cost. Move along now @Xaa.

[twangster]

9 hours ago, _1stTimer said:

 @Xaa, you are virtue signaling and ignoring that I explicitly stated I do not plan to circumvent. Obviously people can go elsewhere. The main reason for buying intenet is for safety/communication with my kids. I read horrible reviews of the RC app for chatting. If there's something someone questions about a service or charge onboard can they not discuss it here? If you don't like discussing the subject of internet cost maybe just move on to the next thread?

------------

Interesting article about O3b which RC used (or still uses)? RC doesn't have to pay for their satellites or their rockets. Not sure what they pay to O3b.

Anyone know which ships are using Starlink now? "SpaceX unveiled Starlink Maritime for boats at a cost of $5,000 per month, on top of a hardware investment of $10,000."

I'll make some possibly conservative assumptions here... let's say 5,000 passengers on a ship and 10% of passengers get internet for one device on a 7-day cruise, so 500 x 7 x $23 = $80,500 for one cruise. 3 cruises in a month = $241,500. Cut that in half if my assumptions are off, and they've still covered the monthly Starlink fee and hardware, and made a fat profit.

We are all eagerly waiting to see what Royal will do once Starlink is available on all of the oceans around the world.  Right now their maritime is rather limited so it's unknown if Royal will use their legacy providers as a fall back or just let the ship go dark when Starlink dead zones are encountered.

I'd love it if Royal were to make basic chat free like some airlines have done for years.  Southwest has allowed WhatsApp, Messenger and iMessage for free for some time as an example.

As far as I know the existing satellite suppliers charged usage fees i.e. per MB fees while Starlink does not.  That could be a huge cost savings and it could mean they can let little text messages that consume very little bandwidth through at no cost.  However that's a business choice cruise lines get to make. 

In a few years time once Starlink is fully built out perhaps Royal will pass along their savings to guests in the form of lower Voom plan prices.  We don't know.

Regardless it's not really any of my business what Royal pays their suppliers versus what I pay for something they resell.  They pay a supplier very little for a bottle of liquor or a case of beer yet they charge resort and bar type fees for these items.  Their ship, their rules.

Presumably my local cable company has recovered their investment in their cabling many years ago so one could argue they should give away internet nearly free.    Yet they have decided to make huge profits from it instead.  Their business, their rules.

Internet on a ship is not a basic human right.  We are at the whims of the cruise lines to pay for the privilege of having internet on board and there are many cruisers who don't want it while on vacation.  To that end it should not be included since that would increase cruise fares for folks that don't want it.  The result is that cruise lines charge for internet and only guests who desire to be connected pay for that choice. 

I don't think Cabanas on CocoCay should cost $1,800 for a few hours of use yet that is what some of my fellow cruisers are willing to pay so that is the price.  Their island, their rules.  I don't like that price but that doesn't mean I should try to sneak into one and use it without paying the charge they have established.  

Voom is no different.  It's not a basic right to have it.  Cruise lines are able to charge and make a profit doing so just like a bottle of beer or a cabana.  If you don't like the prices don't buy it.  Stealing is not a solution if you don't like the price. 

[smokeybandit]

11 minutes ago, twangster said:

I'd love it if Royal were to make basic chat free like some airlines have done for years.  Southwest has allowed WhatsApp, Messenger and iMessage for free for some time as an example.

I've wanted RC to do this. Scrap the dumb internal chat app from the early 2000s and just have people pay for messaging services.  You could probably charge $5 per day or maybe even a little more and people would soak it up.

 

[Xaa]

38 minutes ago, _1stTimer said:

Safety videos! Hahaha. I won't take offense to the sarcasm because that's pretty funny. I think we can all enjoy the subject of internet cost and capabilities. I appreciate hearing all the opinions and experiences. Thanks for your opinion that I should not express an opinion about the cost. Move along now @Xaa.

Peace and love @_1stTimer.  Hope to see you at sea.  

[_1stTimer]

27 minutes ago, smokeybandit said:

I've wanted RC to do this. Scrap the dumb internal chat app from the early 2000s and just have people pay for messaging services.  You could probably charge $5 per day or maybe even a little more and people would soak it up.

Or, to be equitable, why not charge by the amount of data used? Some passengers may watch several movies. Others may just chat or check the news, but all pay the same package fee? 

Edit: better yet, offer unlimited and metered options. 

[twangster]

16 minutes ago, _1stTimer said:

Or, to be equitable, why not charge by the amount of data used? Some passengers may watch several movies. Others may just chat or check the news, but all pay the same package fee? 

Edit: better yet, offer unlimited and metered options. 

There is a lot of marketing effort that goes into offering a product. The trend in cruising has been to move away from buckets of minutes or usage based fees.  Metered plans create uncertainty.  Consumers prefer to know what the cost will be.  

They used to offer different levels of drink packages but that caused a lot of confusion so they consolidated down to one alcohol based plan.   

[_1stTimer]

@twangster, you provide some good info in your posts, but I gotta say...

The following responses are painfully obvious and worn out:

Don't buy it if you don't like the price. Of course. No one is forced to buy extras. Some are, however, more compelled to need something.

It's not a human right. Goes without saying. Assuming that someone considers internet on a cruise a human right is kinda insulting to them, actually.

Circumventing is wrong. At a minimum, it's unethical. It may be a policy violation, but I don't know where to find the policy. Sounds like some people here have tried or done it (routers etc.). I'm not judging them. I hope no one is judging me for asking the question if it can even be done.

[smokeybandit]

I'd love to know how much data the average person who buys an internet package even uses.

My totally uninformed gut feel is that it's not all that much and probably no different than someone would use in their typical daily lives.

[twangster]

18 minutes ago, smokeybandit said:

I'd love to know how much data the average person who buys an internet package even uses.

My totally uninformed gut feel is that it's not all that much and probably no different than someone would use in their typical daily lives.

I was over 2GB on one 5 night cruise and was told I wasn't in the top 3.  

[twangster]

43 minutes ago, _1stTimer said:

@twangster, you provide some good info in your posts, but I gotta say...

The following responses are painfully obvious and worn out:

Don't buy it if you don't like the price. Of course. No one is forced to buy extras. Some are, however, more compelled to need something.

It's not a human right. Goes without saying. Assuming that someone considers internet on a cruise a human right is kinda insulting to them, actually.

Circumventing is wrong. At a minimum, it's unethical. It may be a policy violation, but I don't know where to find the policy. Sounds like some people here have tried or done it (routers etc.). I'm not judging them. I hope no one is judging me for asking the question if it can even be done.

I'm old so I I use old cliches and references.  

[smokeybandit]

23 minutes ago, twangster said:

I was over 2GB on one 5 night cruise and was told I wasn't in the top 3.  

That's seems a reasonable amount

[NYCruisers]

Sorry if this was already discussed but I was wondering if I purchase one internet package could my husband and I alternate using it on two seperate devices?

[USCG Teacher]

4 hours ago, NYCruisers said:

Sorry if this was already discussed but I was wondering if I purchase one internet package could my husband and I alternate using it on two seperate devices?

Yes, you can!  You just have to log out of one device before you can log on to the other.

[PL8SWPR]

On 11/29/2022 at 12:08 AM, _1stTimer said:

 @Xaa

Anyone know which ships are using Starlink now? "SpaceX unveiled Starlink Maritime for boats at a cost of $5,000 per month, on top of a hardware investment of $10,000."

I'll make some possibly conservative assumptions here... let's say 5,000 passengers on a ship and 10% of passengers get internet for one device on a 7-day cruise, so 500 x 7 x $23 = $80,500 for one cruise. 3 cruises in a month = $241,500. Cut that in half if my assumptions are off, and they've still covered the monthly Starlink fee and hardware, and made a fat profit.

 

That $5,000 a month cost was for a "boat" and maxed at 350Mbps or 87 phones at 4Mbps each.  I think a cruise ship with several thousand passengers would need slightly more bandwidth and a hefty commercial account, the cost of which is surely not disclosed. 

[twangster]

37 minutes ago, PL8SWPR said:

 

That $5,000 a month cost was for a "boat" and maxed at 350Mbps or 87 phones at 4Mbps each.  I think a cruise ship with several thousand passengers would need slightly more bandwidth and a hefty commercial account, the cost of which is surely not disclosed. 

Royal installs multiple Starlink maritime antenna and load balances across them.  Oasis has 16 antennas that are visible and I observed that we were using 15 unique public IP addresses in a random round robin fashion likely one public IP address per modem-antenna combo.  

We don't know if the business grade maritime service also has the 350 Mbps limit per antenna/modem pair but that is possibly one reason why Royal is installing so many.  Jewel for example has 8 Starlink antennas and that is what I've seen on Voyager class as well.  

To your point we can't draw any conclusions about how much the Starlink contract costs the Royal Caribbean Group that includes Celebrity ships and possibly SilverSea ships as well.  Surely there is an economy of scale when using hundreds of maritime antenna/modem combos rather than assuming $5k each.