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I just got mine too...

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SUPPORT A RETURN TO SEA
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Dear Valued Crown & Anchor Society members,

Royal Caribbean has deeply missed doing what we do best — delivering great
vacations for our guests. Unfortunately, just yesterday, we had to cancel more
cruises through June 2021, which marks 15 months since we have sailed from a
U.S. homeport.

But we haven’t been standing still. In recent months, Royal Caribbean and other
cruise lines have shown the effectiveness of health protocols while sailing other
parts of the world. The data speaks for itself — more than 400,000 healthy
guests have sailed on cruise ships outside the U.S., all made possible by
protocols developed over months of collaboration with top experts including our
Healthy Sail Panel. This demonstrated success, along with the rollout of the
vaccine in many countries, means cruising will be back this summer for
vacationers departing from the U.K., Israel, Cyprus, Bermuda,
The Bahamas and more homeports.

We’re grateful for our international partners who have invited us back to their
shores. The fact remains, however, that a U.S. return to cruising is essential to
our economy, travel agent partners, the destinations we sail to, and the overall
future vitality of this industry. The cruise community is a vital driver of our
country’s travel economy — and our job market. In fact, the cruise industry
supports nearly 500,000 U.S. jobs — and around 350,000 of these Americans
continue to financially suffer due to the suspension of cruising.

That’s why we’re calling on you, our valued Crown & Anchor Society members,
to make your voices heard. If you’re ready to see cruising return, we urge you
to call, email and tweet your Senators and U.S. Representatives in support of
lifting the CDC’s Conditional Sail Order (CSO) and allowing healthy cruising to
resume from the U.S. by the beginning of July 2021.
 Our friends at Cruise
Lines International Association (CLIA) have designed an Action Center that will
make it easy for you to craft and send your message in just a couple clicks.

If anyone understands the important role that these vacations play in our lives,
it’s you. And we believe with your help, we can bring our ships back to
U.S. homeports.

We appreciate your unwavering support.

Royal Caribbean International
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29 minutes ago, twangster said:

CLIA recently asked everyone, travel agents and all, to spread the word and ask everyone to jump on board the action.

This is Royal getting on board with CLIA's request.

I did CLIA's. I'll do this one, too. I'm on several other cruise lines email lists and if they contact me, I'll do it for them, too!

I'm in favor of whatever gets the CDC's mother bleeping attention! More so, I'm in favor of whatever gets the attention of whomever has any oversight on on the CDC. I want them to have to answer to some higher authority as to why an entire industry is figuratively screaming at them and one state (one so far, that is) has filed a lawsuit against them.

UPDATE: Rats, the email just takes us back to the CLIA site that I already visited/took action at. Anyone wanna join in front of the CDC office with a bullhorn?

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22 minutes ago, SPS said:

UPDATE: Rats, the email just takes us back to the CLIA site that I already visited/took action at. Anyone wanna join in front of the CDC office with a bullhorn?

CDC has an office we can stand in front of? I thought they had taken refuge in one of the "nuclear winter survival bunkers" ??

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Yes,  I’ve sent my thoughts to my congressional reps. Please do the same!!  When I read Buttigieg’s comments, it’s clear he has no idea what he is talking about in relation to what is holding cruising back. The clueless politicians and the DC regulars think the cruise lines need to prove something to start despite sailing successfully for months out of other ports.  DeSantis’ lawsuit is such a welcome sight. 
 

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21 minutes ago, johnt83 said:

Thanks. I always check spam and they are not there.... interesting. Do you know how I can sign up?

I’d check your profile with Royal Caribbean, there’s probably a checkbox someplace.

 

I think you can sign up at this page as well.

 

https://www.royalcaribbean.com/crown-anchor-society

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9 minutes ago, Reigert2008 said:

I’d check your profile with Royal Caribbean, there’s probably a checkbox someplace.

 

I think you can sign up at this page as well.

 

https://www.royalcaribbean.com/crown-anchor-society

Thanks. I just messaged their C&A admins on FB to see if I can get any traction that way. Looks like you can't just "sign up" easily.

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20 hours ago, dodgestang said:

When Royal sends you emails asking you to fill out petitions to US senators and representatives to get the cruise industry restarted.

Until Florida gets a handle on controlling the virus (e.g, new cases and hospitalizations), I doubt Florida ports will stand a chance of reopening.  We need folks to be less self-centered and follow protocols so everyone is safe.  Many Floridians are doing the right thing, but the visiting spring breakers and some others haven't really helped the port re-opening.  I'd urge politicians to pledge to follow recommended COVID protocols.  Then the petitions and lawsuits will appear to be on-target.  Without evidence we are really following safe practices, we can't expect the CDC to have confidence in the mitigation strategies proposed by the cruise lines.

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42 minutes ago, ChessE4 said:

Until Florida gets a handle on controlling the virus (e.g, new cases and hospitalizations), I doubt Florida ports will stand a chance of reopening.  We need folks to be less self-centered and follow protocols so everyone is safe.  Many Floridians are doing the right thing, but the visiting spring breakers and some others haven't really helped the port re-opening.  I'd urge politicians to pledge to follow recommended COVID protocols.  Then the petitions and lawsuits will appear to be on-target.  Without evidence we are really following safe practices, we can't expect the CDC to have confidence in the mitigation strategies proposed by the cruise lines.

CDC recommendations change all the time and are often times not based in science but politics. 6 ft changed to 3ft for social distancing in schools. CDC now saying plexiglass dividers are not needed in schools. Wearing masks outside where multiple studies have now shown that there is virtually ZERO chance if acquiring COVID outdoors. Kids required to wear mask while playing outdoors is anti-science. Florida has the right to determine their own Covid protocols and looking at Florida compared to Michigan,NY and NJ where Covid protocols are stricter, they are doing better. I think States like Texas and Florida have shown the CDC that they are ready to open their cruise ports. Sorry, I will follow the data rather than the highly politicized CDC whose director has to walk back her proclamations on a regular basis

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10 hours ago, DunwoodyDad said:

When I read Buttigieg’s comments, it’s clear he has no idea what he is talking about in relation to what is holding cruising back.

Exactly. This nugget in particular stood out to me:

"One reporter asked Mr. Buttigieg about the double standard cruise lines face that airlines do not, and his response was, "airlines have one safety profile; cruise ships have another.""

He clearly does not know what the differences are when answering the question. He seems to be giving an answer just for the sake of giving an answer. You're gonna have to do better than that Pete. You're the US SoT.

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1 hour ago, ChessE4 said:

Until Florida gets a handle on controlling the virus (e.g, new cases and hospitalizations), I doubt Florida ports will stand a chance of reopening.  We need folks to be less self-centered and follow protocols so everyone is safe.  Many Floridians are doing the right thing, but the visiting spring breakers and some others haven't really helped the port re-opening.  I'd urge politicians to pledge to follow recommended COVID protocols.  Then the petitions and lawsuits will appear to be on-target.  Without evidence we are really following safe practices, we can't expect the CDC to have confidence in the mitigation strategies proposed by the cruise lines.

So my son just turned 18 and asked if he could get vaccinated, jumped online and in about 5 minutes found over 200 appointments within 15 minutes of our home all within the next few days.

At this point anyone in Florida that wants to be vaccinated can be (Maybe other areas of the state aren't quite as strong so lets give it a couple of weeks extra to be safe). Add a couple more weeks for second shots and a couple more weeks for the "ripening period" post shots to full strength on the vaccination effect. 

So amending my statement, by the end of May every resident of Florida that wants to be vaccinated can be vaccinated and the vaccine fully in effect.

At that point asking people to wear masks, socially distance, shut their businesses and their lives down is no longer about me keeping "you" safe because their is no other way to counter the virus, its about me affecting my life to keep "you" safe because you refuse to take the step of getting vaccinated to keep yourself safe. At that point there is no reason to keep anything shut down. (You in this context does not mean ChessE4 since I have no idea if you have been vaccinated or not but refers to the "you" that demands protection by me doing things instead of "you" taking responsibility for doing what you need to do to protect yourself).

If you aren't comfortable getting the vaccine, great do so at your own risk.

If you aren't comfortable coming to Florida to get on a a cruise, great, don't.

 

In terms of following CDC COVID protocols, I think pretty much everyone knows they aren't exactly proven to be effective.

They already admitted they made up the 6 foot rule, before amending it to the 3 foot rule so that we can safely send kids back to school (footnote Florida schools have been in session since August).

They now admit the whole sterilize every surface you can find, every time you see it phenomenon wasn't accurate either ...

Anyone that thinks that haphazardly wearing a random assortment of cloth masks while wandering around outdoors has had a huge impact should immediately contact me about some fantastic waterfront property for sale down in the Everglades.

 

We are at the point where cruising in July should be a non-issue. By then truly we should be at the point where every one who wants want can have one, so make the decision now that by then life will be as normal as it ever will be again and let everyone start planning on it.

 

 

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2 hours ago, ChessE4 said:

Until Florida gets a handle on controlling the virus (e.g, new cases and hospitalizations), I doubt Florida ports will stand a chance of reopening.  We need folks to be less self-centered and follow protocols so everyone is safe.  Many Floridians are doing the right thing, but the visiting spring breakers and some others haven't really helped the port re-opening.  I'd urge politicians to pledge to follow recommended COVID protocols.  Then the petitions and lawsuits will appear to be on-target.  Without evidence we are really following safe practices, we can't expect the CDC to have confidence in the mitigation strategies proposed by the cruise lines.

No Offense but you have no idea what you are talking about. Florida is no worse than any other state. In fact as others have said anyone over 18 who wants a vaccine can get one. I am 34 and I am fully vaccinated. Our state is absolutely ready for cruises to open!!!

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3 hours ago, ChessE4 said:

Until Florida gets a handle on controlling the virus (e.g, new cases and hospitalizations), I doubt Florida ports will stand a chance of reopening.  We need folks to be less self-centered and follow protocols so everyone is safe.  Many Floridians are doing the right thing, but the visiting spring breakers and some others haven't really helped the port re-opening.  I'd urge politicians to pledge to follow recommended COVID protocols.  Then the petitions and lawsuits will appear to be on-target.  Without evidence we are really following safe practices, we can't expect the CDC to have confidence in the mitigation strategies proposed by the cruise lines.

1/2 the per capita death rate of places like NY, NJ, Ma. Ranked 28th in per capita overall cases as a whole. Florida #1 or 2 in vaccine per capita and allowed all the way to 18. No mask mandates but more mask wearing than most states. High over all numbers but to be expected as it is the 3rd largest population. The state is not locked down and is in better shape than those that are... The highest death rates during this thing occurred during the hardest lock downs.  I could see Cape Liberty not opening for the reasons you suggest but not Florida...  Protocols have changed more times than we can count because CDC themselves have no clue what does or doesn't work. So they try different approaches. 

 

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I recently did a campaign of my own attempting to reach out to my politicians  along with the CLIA  one. A couple canned responses  in return. Then I got one from Congressman Brian Mast that bugged me a bit. Its clear that he had received knowledge that a CSO and follow up exist but I'm of firm belief after reading his response that he nor his staff had any clue what is contained within. I pointed out that he really  needs to revisit the topic and at least have a staffer give him a synopsis of the contents. I feel that it is draconian in nature and unfairly singles out an industry for punishment that is not deserved. I did receive receipt that he or at least his office has received  my most recent reply to his reply...  Keep the pressure on gang. We are at a tipping point... 

 

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35 minutes ago, deep1 said:

 Then I got one from Congressman Brian Mast that bugged me a bit. Its clear that he had received knowledge that a CSO and follow up exist but I'm of firm belief after reading his response that he nor his staff had any clue what is contained within. 

 

Can you imagine what the team handling Michael Bayley's inbox has had to deal with because of the pandemic? 

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50 minutes ago, deep1 said:

 Its clear that he had received knowledge that a CSO and follow up exist but I'm of firm belief after reading his response that he nor his staff had any clue what is contained within. 

Hard to believe that a politician would be for or opposed to something they have not fully read and understand. ?

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43 minutes ago, FManke said:

Hard to believe that a politician would be for or opposed to something they have not fully read and understand. ?

He really wasn't taking a side. He got into this wordy way  of saying "There is a CSO and attached statement  from the CDC ". Clear he had not read or had a synopsis forwarded to him. He seemed to think this was the quick fix we want, not the spinning wheels we have seen since October... 

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Just one of the problems the cruise lines are dealing with in getting sailings restarted from US ports is the wrongheaded focus on COVID case numbers as an indicator of pandemic status by public health officials, the CDC being the worst offender because they know better. This gets augmented by the press as they love a crisis. Then the public mood and by extension, public health policy is shaped.

Because of the distorted view of where we really are with controlling the transmission of SARS2 and the disease burden of COVID it's impossible to define a path forward to post-pandemic normalcy. For us cruise fanatics, we see this glaring problem reflected in the NSO, the CSO and the lack of a clear path forward to the resumption of cruising from US ports. 

There are better metrics than COVID case numbers to measure the impact of the disease. Not only that but the impact of COVID is highly regional. The disease burden in MI is different than it is Kansas yet the CDC uses one figure - new case numbers - applied nationally to cast every state in the same dire situation. 

I think Desantis, among other governors of similar persuasion, mostly has the right idea. I'd look to the UK's Boris Johnson though who has pursued an aggressive and prioritized vaccination strategy, similar to Desantis, et. al., but has combined this with highly targeted restrictions on citizen mobility based on a testing strategy that is unique in the world. The UK is doing more testing, particularly genomic testing, to guide the targeting of regional hot spots for mitigation measures. That is smart. They also have a robust national contact tracking and tracing program. The results, so far, are striking. We'll see if it continues.

Sadly, we are stuck with the Biden administration's CDC. I don't see them changing their messaging or outlining a pathway back to a post-pandemic normalcy. Sticking with the CSO, it appears, is reflective of that lack of COVID insight and vision so badly needed here in the US. While there is talk of more testing and the addition of the genomic type, I don't see guidelines from the federal level that trickle down to well designed public health programs at the state level. Ostensibly, that could help guide emerging and improved public health policy on a state by state basis that is more focused and targeted. I just don't see it happening and I don't think vaccines, alone, are going to sufficiently change new case numbers enough to change the public mood and by extension, public health policy. Sadly.

The pending law suit by the state of FL might have an impact if only in the context of our interests in a return to cruising. Despite how good I think the plaintiff's arguments are,  I still think it's a long shot. What we need is a wholesale change in how leading experts from the CDC view the impact of SARS2 going forward while outlining a responsible return to a post pandemic normalcy. If FL wins the case and gets an injunction, that could move the CDC to re-evaluate more than just their approach to the cruise industry. Mid to long term, that's what we need.           

 

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1 hour ago, twangster said:

Can you imagine what the team handling Michael Bayley's inbox has had to deal with because of the pandemic? 

His load has to be brutal... Couldn't imagine... Crews, Passengers, Lenders, Vendors, Shareholders all on his back... 

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57 minutes ago, JeffB said:

If FL wins the case and gets an injunction, that could move the CDC to re-evaluate more than just their approach to the cruise industry. Mid to long term, that's what we need.

So then we wind up with lawyers deciding public health policy.  It isn't that I think that the public health experts have done such a great job.  

I just know that I'm vaccinated.  That seems to be the present criteria for doing more things and getting back to some semblance of normal.  My next booked cruise is in October 2021.  I have a backlog of 5 more cruises in 2022.   I have a significant financial stake in going on those cruises. 

I'm willing to do almost anything to protect my financial interests ---wear a mask, forego my 2021 cruise... anything within reason.  Everything seems so  unreasonable.  If this stretches into 2022 then maybe I will need a lawyer.  But nothing in the legal realm proceeds quickly and will likely cost more than my investment in cruises.  

Maybe just waiting is my only reasonable option.

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8 minutes ago, Dad2Cue said:

So then we wind up with lawyers deciding public health policy.

Well, yes, but only directly in one small segment of activities in the US impacted by the CDC's "the boogey man is coming" messaging.

The SARS2 pandemic is a problem. No denying it. But I remain shocked that the word's governments response to it, after a year of dealing with it, fails to recognize that it is a problem that has to be dealt with by means other than scaring people and having those governments encourage regional entities (the states and counties) to issue more and more restrictions to mobility and/or restrictions to business activities.

One thing I believe is that the impact of the COVID is far less than we are being led to believe it is, that, given the advancements in COVID treatments and the effectiveness of reasonable mitigation measures make it so ..... and I've never believed this whole thing is a hoax. It's real.

It's a real problem but it is one that can be overcome with a combination of vaccines, through increased testing, effective identification and targeting of regional outbreaks for specific and time limited mitigation measures and an effort to restore confidence in US public health policy making entities, namely the CDC. That last one is important because I believe what's happening in the US now - the increased violence and discontent - is largely a result of this "boogey man is coming" messaging emanating from the CDC, augmented by the press that loves a crisis. Instead of that, I'm advocating for a change in tone from one of worry to one of confidence that the virus can be brought to heel. Start with defining a path forward to the resumption of a reasonable post-pandemic normalcy and that includes revisions of the CDC's CSO.        

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8 hours ago, UNCFanatik said:

CDC recommendations change all the time and are often times not based in science but politics. 6 ft changed to 3ft for social distancing in schools. CDC now saying plexiglass dividers are not needed in schools. Wearing masks outside where multiple studies have now shown that there is virtually ZERO chance if acquiring COVID outdoors. Kids required to wear mask while playing outdoors is anti-science. Florida has the right to determine their own Covid protocols and looking at Florida compared to Michigan,NY and NJ where Covid protocols are stricter, they are doing better. I think States like Texas and Florida have shown the CDC that they are ready to open their cruise ports. Sorry, I will follow the data rather than the highly politicized CDC whose director has to walk back her proclamations on a regular basis

I was referring to the article this week about Florida being one of five states with the highest rate of new infections.  I don't think that supports efforts to begin cruising.  I love Florida, I have a brother in Florida, I am booked to cruise from Florida.  But the data could be better...and we need to do a better job in my state, too.  Despite what you have stated, Florida and several other states have made several missteps that have delayed the restart of cruising.  I am glad vaccinations are going up everywhere, as that is making us all safer.

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PCR tests have always been a problem for case counts because the sensitivity of the tests can be ramped up to indicate false positives. 
 

I agree with @JeffB case counts are always a poor metric. Hospitalizations are what to pay more attention to. Especially with the amount of a symptomatic cases. People either don’t know or tend to forget that in 2010 there were an estimated 60.8 million cases in the US of H1N1. 

As long as the government has the attitude of “let no crisis go to waste” and can use the pandemic to pass more and more spending bills, there is an incentive to keep panic among the populace by talking about mutations and variants which actually is counterproductive to get more people vaccinated.

with cruising, it’s hard to get politicians to truly see the economic damage of keeping the cruise industry shutdown that are not from states that are not affected by it.

sadly it seems the time of the government treating the general populace as responsible citizens who are capable of doing their own risk mitigation is passing. The Nanny state now seems to have the attitude that is their job to protect us from ourselves.
 

 

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1 hour ago, ChessE4 said:

I was referring to the article this week about Florida being one of five states with the highest rate of new infections.  I don't think that supports efforts to begin cruising.  I love Florida, I have a brother in Florida, I am booked to cruise from Florida.  But the data could be better...and we need to do a better job in my state, too.  Despite what you have stated, Florida and several other states have made several missteps that have delayed the restart of cruising.  I am glad vaccinations are going up everywhere, as that is making us all safer.

Florida's per capita  rate is low.  We rank 28th in per capita cases and deaths both. Roughly half to two-thirds the death rate in New Jersey again PER CAPITA. The total count is high due to our population  being third largest in the country...

 

 

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14 hours ago, ChessE4 said:

I was referring to the article this week about Florida being one of five states with the highest rate of new infections.  I don't think that supports efforts to begin cruising.  I love Florida, I have a brother in Florida, I am booked to cruise from Florida.  But the data could be better...and we need to do a better job in my state, too.  Despite what you have stated, Florida and several other states have made several missteps that have delayed the restart of cruising.  I am glad vaccinations are going up everywhere, as that is making us all safer.

if you read the whole article that the headline was based off of it was clear that Florida was added into the top 5 just to make the point that Florida is marginally up and Florida must always be held out to be a problem because it fits the narrative.

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I mentioned yesterday that the impact of COVID is likely less than we are led to believe it is. A lot of this has to do with how public health officials report COVD data and then how the press presents it to us.

Giving us case numbers out of context is misleading. For example, on 3/9, FL reported 5007 new cases. A month later, on 4/9, 6817. That's a 36% increase in new cases yet the percent positivity over that same period went up only 1%. When you test more, more new cases are identified...... testing on 3/9 = 175/100K. Testing on 4/9 = 282/100K. That's a 37% increase in daily testing producing an expected 36% rise in new cases. 

On 3/9, FL had 3419 patients hospitalized with a COVID diagnosis. On 4/9, 3016.

But this is the kicker - deaths:

Deaths.thumb.JPG.5874dafdfca90e2a46ec0935553f4faa.JPG

Need I say more? Florida is fine.

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4 hours ago, JeffB said:

But this is the kicker - deaths:

Deaths.thumb.JPG.5874dafdfca90e2a46ec0935553f4faa.JPG

Need I say more? Florida is fine.

And the other kicker is that it takes weeks for deaths to make it to the reports ?

That said, I personally am all for vaccinated reduced capacity cruises.  Since kids are going back to school, with 3 ft or less between them - let them cruise with a negative PCR test, as well.

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My son's elementary school has been full in person since last August, and kids 10 and under don't have to wear masks with no effort to socially distance other than keeping each class in its own cohort (though kids of the same grade can recently all mingle at outdoor recess)

 

We've had zero in school transmission.

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