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Would you do a B2B Med itinerary?


JLMoran

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So with our 2020 Iceland & Greenland cruise canceled and nothing on deck for 2021, I'm waiting for the 2022 European itineraries to come out. My family has said they want go to the Mediterranean. Not Iceland. Not Norway. Not Alaska. The Med-i-ter-ran-ian, thank you.

So, I have no choice.

What I do have a choice about is the itinerary... or itineraries.

Seems like it's really hard to find sailings longer than 7 nights on the mass-market, upscale mass-market, or even luxury lines. Every line I've checked has mostly 7-night sailings, with a smattering of 10 and 11 night. Absolutely no one seems to have a 2-week itinerary option that isn't a transatlantic. So...

I'm thinking about booking a B2B, most likely out of Rome, that would cover eastern (Italy, Greek Isles, and if I'm lucky Croatia / Montenegro) and western (Italy, France, Spain). I know how port-intensive most Med itineraries are, and this may honestly be nuts to even consider. But I have some good reasons:

  • This will most likely be our last vacation taken as a family. My older daughter will have graduated college and will almost certainly be starting a new job and living somewhere on her own; while my younger one will be starting college at the end of August that year.
  • Only my wife has been to the Mediterranean before, and it will likely be our only trip there for many years.
  • I have mobility issues that are only going to get worse as the years go by; I'd rather burn myself out in '22 and know I've seen as much as I could, just in case I'm unable to do that kind of trip in 15 or 20 years, when I'm retired.
  • I won't have done any kind of big vacation in over 2 years by that point, so if I'm going to have a big trip then let's have a big trip

 

But is this overreaching? Are the itineraries so intense and draining that going for a second week is foolish?

I was figuring that any B2B we did would have at least one port overlapping both legs, so that we could use one of the overlaps as a "rest day" and just stay on the ship or do nothing more than go into town for lunch and maybe some souvenir shopping. And western itineraries do seem to typically have one sea day, sometimes two, so that will be another chance to recharge.

Would you do this, or should I just find the best 10/11 night option that we all agree on and leave it at that?

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Well, IMHO I am going to say YOLO! You have stated that you have issues that will keep you from being able to do this as you get older, and you are just as much of a cruise junkie as I am!  In other words DO IT!!!  I know it has been awhile since we all have been able to take a cruise and we all need a vacation, so if I were in your shoes that cruise would be booked immediately!!!

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RCL tends to have a 12nt cruise on Vision of the Seas that incorporates alot of both sides of the Mediterranean. 

not sure which lines you're more loyal to, but I know NCL has some longer itineraries that may better suit your needs. 

10nt cruise on NCL Escape, for example....July 2022

  • Rome (Civitavecchia),Italy
  • Santorini,Greece
  • Athens (Piraeus),Greece
  • Mykonos,Greece
  • Corfu,Greece
  • Valletta,Malta
  • Messina (Sicily),Italy
  • Naples,Italy
  • Florence/Pisa (Livorno),Italy
  • Rome (Civitavecchia),Italy
Let me know what you think!
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3 hours ago, bigpete said:

RCL tends to have a 12nt cruise on Vision of the Seas that incorporates alot of both sides of the Mediterranean. 

not sure which lines you're more loyal to, but I know NCL has some longer itineraries that may better suit your needs. 

10nt cruise on NCL Escape, for example....July 2022

  • Rome (Civitavecchia),Italy
  • Santorini,Greece
  • Athens (Piraeus),Greece
  • Mykonos,Greece
  • Corfu,Greece
  • Valletta,Malta
  • Messina (Sicily),Italy
  • Naples,Italy
  • Florence/Pisa (Livorno),Italy
  • Rome (Civitavecchia),Italy
Let me know what you think!

I’m really not interested in a Vision-class ship, but I actually have that NCL itinerary on my current “to be strongly considered” list. It’s actually what prompted this post, as I was looking at possibly combining that with a 7-night on Norwegian Epic out of Civitavecchia to the western Med as a S2S. Would have to spend a night or two in Rome in between the sailings, but my mom has lifelong friends who live there and who I’m sure would be happy to show us around.

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Just pace yourself, especially with a potential mobility challenge.

Plan on taking it easy and maybe skipping a port on cruise 1 or build your excursion plan with some bus/boat/car/train rides where you aren't on your feet the entire first cruise.  That will hopefully leave some gas in the tank for cruise 2.  If you go too hard cruise 1 you may find cruise 2 is impacted.   

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Looks like you and I are planning similar cruises!

I would highly recommend you plan for some time in Rome if you have never been.

With that being said, I don't think there is anything wrong with B2B cruises... but I think your instinct for the 10-11 night cruises may be a better way to enjoy the Med AND experience one of the most historical cities in the world. May I suggest planning some cushion days on the back end of your cruise (this way you aren't completely jet-lagged). We were able to see "everything" in the 3 days we had planned there. We are always so tired after our cruises... if you can plan for 4-5 relaxing days in Rome, enjoy the wine, see the sights (there are so many to see), eat the great food... you won't regret it... I promise. 

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5 hours ago, JLMoran said:

I’m really not interested in a Vision-class ship, but I actually have that NCL itinerary on my current “to be strongly considered” list. It’s actually what prompted this post, as I was looking at possibly combining that with a 7-night on Norwegian Epic out of Civitavecchia to the western Med as a S2S. Would have to spend a night or two in Rome in between the sailings, but my mom has lifelong friends who live there and who I’m sure would be happy to show us around.

That sounds like a great plan! There might be an Oasis class doing that 7-night run out of Civi. Royal have regularly, although not always, interported that one, with embarkation available in both Barcelona and Civi. I think someone suggested Allure might be in the Med in 2022.

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12 hours ago, JLMoran said:

I was figuring that any B2B we did would have at least one port overlapping both legs, so that we could use one of the overlaps as a "rest day" and just stay on the ship or do nothing more than go into town for lunch and maybe some souvenir shopping. And western itineraries do seem to typically have one sea day, sometimes two, so that will be another chance to recharge.

Would you do this, or should I just find the best 10/11 night option that we all agree on and leave it at that?

Good questions , 

Its all depends what you want to do and what you want to see.

Yes , for the first cruise the ports can be very intensive but its just a matter of planning. Western Med cruise is different from the Greek island once , 

Here some points.

Rome WM will disembark at Wednesday while Greek Island one will start at Friday or Saturday so you will have at least three days to be in Rome , and you want to go to Rome and not stay at the port ...

Greek Island cruise can also be around 9 days from Rome so check it out.   

Ports : 

Barcelona - very near the port (you can even walk) lots to see.
Palma - 15 minutes from ports - busses are alliable for 8 Euros , 5 minutes walk from the bus , This can be less intensive port , two /three hours you cover the city and the other option is to go to one of the beaches.
Marchelle - 20 minutes from the port (buses are available including one free buses but you need to walk 0.8 miles to this bus)  - can be half intensive port - if only the old port you need few hours , if you want to visit other small cities you need more time.
La Spezia  - Very intensive port if you decide to visit Florence as its 2 hours drive , I would skip the Pisa as there are many things to see and do in Florence.
Rome - well you are going to be there anyway ,  I think you can spent 3 full days there (and more).
Napoli - Many things to do , you need to decide if you will do Santorini (its a full day) or Pompeii/Sorento /Napoli , yes there are some tours that offer all the 3 , but I think its crazy to try and do everything in one day (Santorini - at least 6 hours including the boat ride , Pompeii - 1.5/2 hours , Sorento 2 hours , Napoli 2-3 hours) 
One Sea day ...

The Greek main ports:

Athens - 20 minutes from Port , need a full day there.
Santorini -  Tendring port , require full day with the Tendring time.
Mykonos - Tendring port  , half intensive port , 3-4 hours to go around the village and seat at one of the coffee shops.
Croatia - full day , lots to see.
Kotor - Tendring port , can be half intensive (if just staying near the old port and city) or it can be more intensive 

 

In other words , even if you will take just the W Med B2B it can still work for you without seeing the same things twice , something like : 

Barcelona - different parts of the cities 
Palma - Old city /Stay on boat 
Marchelle - Old port and city / touring the small villages near Marchelle.
Ka Spezia - Florence/cinque terre
Napoli - Santorini/ Pompeii Amalfi  road.


  

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3 hours ago, FionaMG said:

That sounds like a great plan! There might be an Oasis class doing that 7-night run out of Civi. Royal have regularly, although not always, interported that one, with embarkation available in both Barcelona and Civi. I think someone suggested Allure might be in the Med in 2022.

I will confess that with Royal I’m looking at a S2S with Odyssey and Allure — assuming the same itineraries are offered in ‘22 that they have for ‘21. That does the Greek isles on Odyssey (9 nights IIRC), followed by a couple days in Rome before getting on Allure (seems like it’ll be the summer ‘22 Med ship) for a 7-night western Med.

But I have some hesitation about this. Why should I spend the premium to sail these ships when I will have almost no time to actually enjoy everything they offer?

I realize I’m somewhat contradicting myself given I said I don’t want to sail on Vision class, which is the ultimate “who cares that the ship has nothing to do on board, I’m not gonna BE on board for 95% of the time” ship class. What I think I’d like most is a Radiance class ship (or similar with other lines), where’s a little bit to do on days where we have the energy and time; and where the ship is just that little bit newer and nicer than Vision class, but not the over abundance of amenities that I would be missing out on with Q / O class.

Hopefully Royal will offer at least one itinerary I could take on an R class, although that will almost certainly mean sailing out of Venice (Ravenna now?), and then doing a transfer to Rome to complete a S2S. Guess I’ll find out later this week. (I hope!)

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@Traveler, thanks for all that info! Especially the relative intensity of each port and the bus availability. I’ve copied all of that into my planning notes for future reference.

I had no idea there was a Santorini in Italy as well as Greece, or that it was a main draw out of Napoli. Going to have to look that up and read about it now.

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9 minutes ago, JLMoran said:

@Traveler, thanks for all that info! Especially the relative intensity of each port and the bus availability. I’ve copied all of that into my planning notes for future reference.

I had no idea there was a Santorini in Italy as well as Greece, or that it was a main draw out of Napoli. Going to have to look that up and read about it now.

Sorry ,  typed too fast , its Capri ... ?

I have done this route around 4-5 times , I can tell you that every time we find something else to do over there.  The main question is what your family wants to see , 

 

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Another things to take into consideration is if you are doing real back2back on the same ship on the same day you will save around 200-250 Euro just to go to Rome and back to the ship (unless you want to take the train). 

No reason to stay near the port there , nothing really interesting (comparing to Rome) , one other option will be to rent a car after the first port and to travel around , but than again , if you have few days I would go to Rome , its almost a full day if you want to do the Vatican + the Vatican Museum, Another day to go to the important places and one more day just to enjoy other things. 

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35 minutes ago, bigpete said:

Maybe you could do the Oasis-class Western med and then take a train up to Ravenna, then do R-class Eastern Med?

Once a year typically they offer a great 8night Itinerary out of Venice/Ravenna that sees Croatia, Montenegro and a bunch of the Isles. 

Maybe they will still have V class  or even one of the Q class to do the East Med 

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32 minutes ago, Traveler said:

Maybe they will still have V class  or even one of the Q class to do the East Med 

Yes, it's quite possible they'll keep Odyssey running that Greek Isles with Extended Stay in Mykonos (and Santorini? Can't remember right now) that she's running for 2021. It won't be top of my list if they do (see my prior reply with thoughts about Q & O class), but it would be an option I'd consider.

1 hour ago, Traveler said:

Sorry ,  typed too fast , its Capri ... ?

No worries! Still good to know that's another port we have to keep in mind as a possible must-see. I think I remember you posting pictures from there in one of your past Med cruise blogs. Looked gorgeous!

 

1 hour ago, bigpete said:

Maybe you could do the Oasis-class Western med and then take a train up to Ravenna, then do R-class Eastern Med?

It's something I'd consider, although again I think an O-class ship is kind of wasted on a Med cruise. Just too much happening every day off the ship to properly appreciate and enjoy what's onboard. To me, those ships are just meant for the Caribbean, and even then on itineraries with few ports and mostly sea days where the ship is supposed to be the main destination.

Which, if you know me, isn't the state of mind I'm in when it comes to cruising. ? 

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8 minutes ago, JLMoran said:

Yes, it's quite possible they'll keep Odyssey running that Greek Isles with Extended Stay in Mykonos (and Santorini? Can't remember right now) that she's running for 2021. It won't be top of my list if they do (see my prior reply with thoughts about Q & O class), but it would be an option I'd consider.

No worries! Still good to know that's another port we have to keep in mind as a possible must-see. I think I remember you posting pictures from there in one of your past Med cruise blogs. Looked gorgeous!

 

It's something I'd consider, although again I think an O-class ship is kind of wasted on a Med cruise. Just too much happening every day off the ship to properly appreciate and enjoy what's onboard. To me, those ships are just meant for the Caribbean, and even then on itineraries with few ports and mostly sea days where the ship is supposed to be the main destination.

Which, if you know me, isn't the state of mind I'm in when it comes to cruising. ? 

Agree with the "O"-class comment.  We did the Med on Symphony - but spent all our port time off ship and really didn't get a chance to do all the "ship things" we wanted to do.  Save those O - class for tired/repeat itineraries or if you're less mobile and have less interest in disembarking.   They're resorts unto themselves.

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11 hours ago, JLMoran said:

I’m really not interested in a Vision-class ship, but I actually have that NCL itinerary on my current “to be strongly considered” list. It’s actually what prompted this post, as I was looking at possibly combining that with a 7-night on Norwegian Epic out of Civitavecchia to the western Med as a S2S. Would have to spend a night or two in Rome in between the sailings, but my mom has lifelong friends who live there and who I’m sure would be happy to show us around.

Going back to this one, I wanted to mention that many years back, I cruised on the Epic and it just did not meet expectations. It felt more like a ferry service with people embarking at EVERY port (not just Rome or Barcelona)... but maybe it changed. Do they have any smaller ships doing med? 

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3 minutes ago, WAAAYTOOO said:

We cruised on  Epic many years ago.  While the ship itself was ok I really HATED the balcony rooms.  They had a split bathroom with the sink out in the room.  It was very weird.  The balconies were very narrow.

I agree! As a man I really disliked having to shave while sitting on the bed! Really tough to split with a family too.

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1 hour ago, JLMoran said:

It won't be top of my list if they do (see my prior reply with thoughts about Q & O class), but it would be an option I'd consider.

I have done V class twice at this area and it was good , although I must say I do like the option of the O class even in the Med since even if I was full day touring the port area I still like to see a Broadway show , Enjoy the Aqua show and choose a restaurant , so yes , I do not need the big pools  but I do enjoy walking in the central park during the evenings ... Regarding the R , yes they should have even from Rome , in April we were suppose to be on a 11 night cruise from Rome to W Med on Jewel OTS.   

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On a side note, I'm really hoping that Royal will have a cruise to Israel during the summer season like NCL is planning to have in 2023. Sorry, @JLMoran but that would make your decision a lot more difficult likely!

 

Does anybody think this is possible or would they stick to the Off-season cruises to Israel. only time will tell....

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43 minutes ago, bigpete said:

Going back to this one, I wanted to mention that many years back, I cruised on the Epic and it just did not meet expectations. It felt more like a ferry service with people embarking at EVERY port (not just Rome or Barcelona)... but maybe it changed. Do they have any smaller ships doing med? 

Epic and Escape were the only two ships that worked with my timeline and a possible B2B S2S. Gem has some sailings as well out of Venice, IIRC, but the timing of them didn't look like it would line up with not rushing to Rome / Civitavecchia to get on a second leg. Might re-check that, though.

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We’ve got a 9 night on Odyssey with overnight in Athens for October 2021. 
 

I had the same concerns as you doing a brand new Q class and not being on the ship enough to “see” the ship. However, this 9 night has 2 sea days. The first one is the first day so between embarkation day and the next day at sea, that’ll be good for exploring the ship. Our last sea day is day before last. 
 

This notion of not enjoying the ship is why we didn’t go with a 7 day oasis class. 
 

We will be doing a 3 day land tour of Rome after the cruise. We originally were going to do Rome before but with COVID this year I fear getting exposed at the crowded tourist traps and testing positive at the pier. So land tour is at the end. 
 

Total time of vacation will be 2 weeks. 

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So I'm still waiting for Royal and X to release their itineraries, but in the meantime Princess has released theirs and they have some nice longer options. Essentially, they offer 14-night and 21-night sailings that are nothing more than chaining together their 7-night open-jaw sailings around the Med on Regal Princess. So depending on the regions you want to see, just pick a starting port and go from there. Princess isn't my top choice of cruise line; but even compared with 2021 offerings from Royal and X, or the '22 options on NCL, they are definitely the winner for itinerary choice so far.

My wife has told me I have to cap any sailing to 14 nights, since she'll be in a new job and likely won't have more than 2 weeks of time off plus a couple of personal days. So with that in mind, I've narrowed it down to either a sailing out of Rome (my preference), or one out of Barcelona that my wife might have a preference for. Going to discuss with her tonight and then ask my TA to put a hold on a pair of aft balcony cabins for whatever we agree to.

Rome 14-night Sailing     Barcelona 14-night sailing

Both are nice itineraries, but I like the Rome one better because it has all the best Greek ports, plus Montenegro, and two stops in Naples (can see Capri and Pompeii). And we can fly in to Rome a day or two early and explore at our leisure before taking a bus to Civitavecchia on boarding day, vs having a badly rushed day trying to do Rome as a port stop day. And while I know Barcelona has its own draws, like the Sagrada Familia, I'd rather see the Coliseum, Trevi Fountain, and some of the other ancient / historic sites; maybe Vatican City if we got there with an extra day to spare. And losing out on Santorini and Kotor with that Barcelona sailing would be kind of crushing for me, since I feel like Santorini is one of those must-see stops on any Greek Isles cruise and Kotor just looks really beautiful. But, happy wife = happy life.

All of this will be moot if Royal or X have something better, even if it's a S2S that still totals 14 nights

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My wife and younger daughter threw me a curve ball. I showed them the third itinerary option, which I hadn't listed here and figured wouldn't be as appealing because barely any Greek Isles stops, and only a single stop in Naples (so only time to see one sight). Well, they liked that one the best. Waiting to see what my older daughter prefers, but I might be on the "losing" end of this discussion. ?

image.png.487a6f9e877bb887049af2619a649ed1.png

 

(Apologies for the size of these images; I'm double-clicking them and setting the size to 1/4 what they're showing here, and it looks fine during entry or edit, but refuses to "stick" once I save it)

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On 11/29/2020 at 3:24 PM, JLMoran said:

 

  • This will most likely be our last vacation taken as a family. My older daughter will have graduated college and will almost certainly be starting a new job and living somewhere on her own; while my younger one will be starting college at the end of August that year.

 

 

Just keep in mind this isn't necessarily true.  My wife went on several cruises with her parents after she graduated college.  The last one they did was an Alaska cruise in when she was 28 years old.  Her older sister was 32.  I went on a family trip to with my parents to London when was 24.  My sister was 18.  When you are in your 20's and have no money, spending a week on vacation somewhere with your parents sounds wonderful, especially if they are paying.  When you have rent and a car payment to deal with, and you are just starting out, you don't have a lot of money available for a vacation.  

And then once your kids have kids, your kids will want to invite you on trips to have some extra hands to watch your grandchildren.  I have done several cruises with my wife and kids, and various combinations of my mother, my in-laws, my sister, my wife's sister's family, etc.  Once you get to this point, you'll only need to pay for your own fare ?

I certainly agree that it's more complicated to arrange these things as times goes on, but I really doubt this trip you are planning will be the last one you take with your daughters.

 

 

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6 minutes ago, karl_nj said:

I certainly agree that it's more complicated to arrange these things as times goes on, but I really doubt this trip you are planning will be the last one you take with your daughters.

I would agree with that, but it will definitely be the last one for at least a long while. My younger one has plans to live in Japan after she finishes college, since she wants to get into the gaming industry (character design). And while she's in college, she plans on doing as many summer abroad and summer internship programs as possible (and that what we've saved up will pay for), including... a month-long summer program in Japan that the school offers to all Sophomores, Juniors, and Seniors looking to get into the Japanese art industry.

So it may not be the last trip as a family, it could be the last for a long time, until she gets the pay scale that allows for trips back to the US or Europe to join us on family outings.

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So your other option is to spend more time on land ahead of time.  If my "lift-and-shift" to August 2021 actually happens, i'll be spending 5 nights in Rome before my 7 night cruise.

If i'm sailing out of Florida, I like to get down there 1 day in advance.  If i'm sailing out of Europe, I like to get there a few days in advance.  If there is an issue with the airplane, there are fewer flights to Europe then there are from NY/NJ to Florida.  I also like to have a few days to get adjusted to the time change.  

If your wife has limited vacation time, and you book a 14 day cruise, are you going to be able to arrive in Europe a few days before your cruise?

 

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3 minutes ago, karl_nj said:

If your wife has limited vacation time, and you book a 14 day cruise, are you going to be able to arrive in Europe a few days before your cruise?

I think that will be more workable with whoever her new employer ends up being than trying to get nearly 4 weeks in total. ?

The cruises all leave on Saturdays, so we'd have to fly down the Wednesday or Thursday before then. But at least we can fly home on Sunday, using the debarkation day to stay the night and have some more relaxed sightseeing at our debarkation port. And she can be back to work on Monday, especially since the jet lag will work in her favor for being up nice and early for work. ?

I'll probably work from home that Monday if she's not in a work-from-home job herself, and do the metric ton of laundry we'll have after all that.

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29 minutes ago, JLMoran said:

My wife and younger daughter threw me a curve ball. I showed them the third itinerary option, which I hadn't listed here and figured wouldn't be as appealing because barely any Greek Isles stops, and only a single stop in Naples (so only time to see one sight). Well, they liked that one the best. Waiting to see what my older daughter prefers, but I might be on the "losing" end of this discussion. ?

 

I personally would definitely pick the one that includes Istanbul and Ephesus! I've wanted to go to those places for the longest time. Plus Crete isn't found on many itineraries, but the standard "Western Med" (Marseilles, La Spezia) has been offered for as long as I can remember and will probably continue to be. On the idea of variation alone, I think the Rome - Athens - Barcelona cruise is the best! But it is all your pick. 

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My older daughter gave the cop-out answer -- "Whatever you guys want, I'm just happy to be traveling anywhere!" ?

So my TA will be putting a hold on two aft-facing balcony rooms for the 14-night Athens-to-Rome option, sailing July 16. Barring Royal or X coming out with something just as good or better (itineraries are supposedly coming out Friday, but we'll see...), and without being too much more money, this will likely end up being our trip for 2022.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Final winner, after waiting for all the other candidate lines (Royal, Celebrity, MSC, HAL, Silver Sea, Oceania) to release their itineraries (I gave up waiting on HAL), was Princess. We'll be doing the 14-night Western Mediterranean and Aegean Medley on July 16, 2022. In case you missed it earlier:

image.png.487a6f9e877bb887049af2619a649ed1.png

Saturday departure and arrival, so we'll likely head out a couple days early to have time to explore Athens and get over jet lag before embarking. Meanwhile...

 

? 577 days 'til we go on the cruise, 577 days 'til we goooooo!

Excursion planning to do! Hotel and Air too!

577 days 'til we go on the cruise! ?

 

 

Dang, it feels good to finally sing that song again!!!!

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