hospital ships

[RCVoyager]

All this talk about ships being flagged here or there is important.  But there are many facets of this story.  Until today there were two ships that still had passengers and crew on them, and they were in need.  Thankfully, finally they have docked in Ft. Lauderdale.

Here's another part of the story:  I read someplace today that RCCL and Carnival have offered idle ships to US cities in this time of need.  The ships have been cleaned front to back and top to bottom.  In an emergency, we need to help each other.

I for one, am glad both of the things mentioned above have happened.  We are at our best when we give our last dollar.  My life has been such, that I've been on both sides of this equation.  

We can sort out the need to reflag these ships and place blame after lives are saved.

 

Off topic a bit, but not really:  I am reminded of the story of Beck Weathers.  He was a very rich very well connected doctor from Dallas, TX.  He was high on Mt. Everest on May 10, 1996 when a storm struck.  Many people died that day and many more lives hung in the balance including Beck's.  He would need to evacuated by helicopter from above the ice fall, an altitude above 20,000 feet.  It had never been done before and if anyone ever dared try it there is no way that pilot would temp fate a 2nd time.

Word got to his wife in TX and all the right calls were made.  Sure enough a pilot was found who dared to try it in his completely stripped down copter.  1 chance and 1 live would be saved of the dozen or so who needed to be saved.  But, Beck was connected.  Sure enough the pilot landed that copter on the makeshift helipad and just as Beck was prepared to be loaded, word came that a sherpa was sicker than him.  Swelling on the brain and would be dead within the hour if he didn't get to lower altitude.  Imagine a copter at full throttle but barely able to get 2 or 3 feet off the ground in the thin air and then dropping almost out of control until it finally felt the bite of denser air below.

In the end, it was Beck Weathers who made the call.  A man he never met would be given the helicopter that was sent for him.  If there wasn't enough heroism that day, somehow the pilot, whose name I don't recall, found the courage to come up the icefall a second time to take Beck to safety.

I haven't read the book in 10 years, so some of the details may be a little fuzzy.  But that is a true story and a lesson for us all.

[twangster]

Carnival's offer to use some of their ships was a smart business play.  Carnival has contracted their ships to FEMA on a number of occasions in the recent past.  In the past they simply cancelled booked cruises and sent their ships to New Orleans after Katrina and to St Thomas after Irma just to name a few such contracts.

Their offer this time was even smarter because their ships are empty.  There are no booked cruises to cancel so they'll make even more money than they did with the previous FEMA contacts.  Make no mistake, the offer wasn't to use them for free.  

The criteria for mobile hospitals include the requirement of a large open unused space.  They don't want to move anything to make space available and they want a large open space because it suits the needs of being able to easily move in patient areas.  A cruise ship is immediately disqualified for being converted into a hospital because it is not empty nor is it a large open space.   Ironically the Brooklyn cruise terminal is being converted into a mobile hospital because it is a large open space.

Cruise ships will not be used as hospitals.

The number of cruise ships in the entire world is a drop in the bucket compared to the number of cargo, container and tanker ships in the world.  99% of them are foreign flagged.  

If the shipping lines were required to flag their ships in America the resulting taxation would cause significant increases to costs.  That's why smart businesses don't flag their cargo, container, tanker or cruise ships in America.

Our own president explained that he not paying any taxes is smart.    He has stated that he is simply using the tax code as it is written to eliminate any tax obligation.  Indeed it is smart.   All politicians and companies use the tax code to minimize their tax obligation.  That is smart business.  

There will be no reflagging of tens of thousands of ships or even the 400+ cruise ships in the CLIA fleet after this is over.  It's simply not going to happen.

  

[Andrew72681]

13 minutes ago, twangster said:

Carnival's offer to use some of their ships was a smart business play.  Carnival has contracted their ships to FEMA on a number of occasions in the recent past.  In the past they simply cancelled booked cruises and sent their ships to New Orleans after Katrina and to St Thomas after Irma just to name a few such contracts.

Their offer this time was even smarter because their ships are empty.  There are no booked cruises to cancel so they'll make even more money than they did with the previous FEMA contacts.  Make no mistake, the offer wasn't to use them for free.  

The criteria for mobile hospitals include the requirement of a large open unused space.  They don't want to move anything to make space available and they want a large open space because it suits the needs of being able to easily move in patient areas.  A cruise ship is immediately disqualified for being converted into a hospital because it is not empty nor is it a large open space.   Ironically the Brooklyn cruise terminal is being converted into a mobile hospital because it is a large open space.

Cruise ships will not be used as hospitals.

The number of cruise ships in the entire world is a drop in the bucket compared to the number of cargo, container and tanker ships in the world.  99% of them are foreign flagged.  

If the shipping lines were required to flag their ships in America the resulting taxation would cause significant increases to costs.  That's why smart businesses don't flag their cargo, container, tanker or cruise ships in America.

Our own president explained that he not paying any taxes is smart.    He has stated that he is simply using the tax code as it is written to eliminate any tax obligation.  Indeed it is smart.   All politicians and companies use the tax code to minimize their tax obligation.  That is smart business.  

There will be no reflagging of tens of thousands of ships or even the 400+ cruise ships in the CLIA fleet after this is over.  It's simply not going to happen.

  

Used as hospital ships, I agree with you. But I could see them sending asymptomatic carriers or those who may have been exposed into a secured quarantine. While it doesn't have a big open space, most ships do have something most jails also have, only a couple of "front doors"

[monctonguy]

20 minutes ago, twangster said:

Carnival's offer to use some of their ships was a smart business play.  Carnival has contracted their ships to FEMA on a number of occasions in the recent past.  In the past they simply cancelled booked cruises and sent their ships to New Orleans after Katrina and to St Thomas after Irma just to name a few such contracts.

Their offer this time was even smarter because their ships are empty.  There are no booked cruises to cancel so they'll make even more money than they did with the previous FEMA contacts.  Make no mistake, the offer wasn't to use them for free.  

The criteria for mobile hospitals include the requirement of a large open unused space.  They don't want to move anything to make space available and they want a large open space because it suits the needs of being able to easily move in patient areas.  A cruise ship is immediately disqualified for being converted into a hospital because it is not empty nor is it a large open space.   Ironically the Brooklyn cruise terminal is being converted into a mobile hospital because it is a large open space.

Cruise ships will not be used as hospitals.

The number of cruise ships in the entire world is a drop in the bucket compared to the number of cargo, container and tanker ships in the world.  99% of them are foreign flagged.  

If the shipping lines were required to flag their ships in America the resulting taxation would cause significant increases to costs.  That's why smart businesses don't flag their cargo, container, tanker or cruise ships in America.

Our own president explained that he not paying any taxes is smart.    He has stated that he is simply using the tax code as it is written to eliminate any tax obligation.  Indeed it is smart.   All politicians and companies use the tax code to minimize their tax obligation.  That is smart business.  

There will be no reflagging of tens of thousands of ships or even the 400+ cruise ships in the CLIA fleet after this is over.  It's simply not going to happen.

  

You would NEVER see a ship registered to Canada....the taxes would bankrupt the company....lol

[whoa]

11 minutes ago, monctonguy said:

You would NEVER see a ship registered to Canada....the taxes would bankrupt the company....lol

As always, there's a fine line between free enterprise and social order/justice.

[DunkelBierJay]

10 hours ago, RCVoyager said:

Off topic a bit, but not really:  I am reminded of the story of Beck Weathers.  He was a very rich very well connected doctor from Dallas, TX.  He was high on Mt. Everest on May 10, 1996 when a storm struck.  Many people died that day and many more lives hung in the balance including Beck's.  He would need to evacuated by helicopter from above the ice fall, an altitude above 20,000 feet.  It had never been done before and if anyone ever dared try it there is no way that pilot would temp fate a 2nd time.

Word got to his wife in TX and all the right calls were made.  Sure enough a pilot was found who dared to try it in his completely stripped down copter.  1 chance and 1 live would be saved of the dozen or so who needed to be saved.  But, Beck was connected.  Sure enough the pilot landed that copter on the makeshift helipad and just as Beck was prepared to be loaded, word came that a sherpa was sicker than him.  Swelling on the brain and would be dead within the hour if he didn't get to lower altitude.  Imagine a copter at full throttle but barely able to get 2 or 3 feet off the ground in the thin air and then dropping almost out of control until it finally felt the bite of denser air below.

In the end, it was Beck Weathers who made the call.  A man he never met would be given the helicopter that was sent for him.  If there wasn't enough heroism that day, somehow the pilot, whose name I don't recall, found the courage to come up the icefall a second time to take Beck to safety.

I haven't read the book in 10 years, so some of the details may be a little fuzzy.  But that is a true story and a lesson for us all.

Into Thin Air by Jon Krakauer is one of my favorite books telling the story that included Beck Weathers and everyone else who was on the mountain that year -- back when I was fit enough for some hiking/mountaineering...there are LOTS of videos on YouTube documenting it, and when there's time to kill while we are stuck at home, it's a nice break from watching PTZTV of Port Miami and Port Everglades. I hang on every word Beck Weathers utters when he is interviewed. He is a good man.

[RCVoyager]

25 minutes ago, DunkelBierJay said:

Into Thin Air by Jon Krakauer is one of my favorite books telling the story that included Beck Weathers and everyone else who was on the mountain that year -- back when I was fit enough for some hiking/mountaineering...there are LOTS of videos on YouTube documenting it, and when there's time to kill while we are stuck at home, it's a nice break from watching PTZTV of Port Miami and Port Everglades. I hang on every word Beck Weathers utters when he is interviewed. He is a good man.

I'm not an avid reader, I simply don't have time.  But I do read when I can.  With that said, Into Thin Air is the best book I've read.  The happenstance of putting a great writer into the middle of an unfolding disaster, as it happens, is in and of itself a perfect storm for writing a perfect book.  

One of the critics called it "written to within an inch of it's life".  That pretty much sums it up.