Jump to content

Proposed Restrictions for Guests Over 70


Recommended Posts

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/11/coronavirus-cruise-industry-proposes-travel-ban-for-people-over-70.html

The proposal would restrict people over the age of 70 from getting on a ship unless they can provide written consent from a doctor, the sources said. 

CLIA submitted the response to the White House in the wake of the meeting with the VP over the weekend.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, accio7 said:

A passenger received this letter from the VP of NCL today, it was posted in one of my FB cruising groups. I wonder if Royal is planning to send out something similar soon.

I think Yes.. Vicky Freed Vice President of Sales and deals with travel agents did a webcast on Tuesday and said this was proposed to the White House on Tuesday.. So I am pretty sure that yes this is going to go forward. Basically it requires people over 70 to get a form filled out by a doctor saying they are not sick and fit to cruise. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

MSC has now issued restrictions for their guests over 70 years of age and also includes travel ban restrictions disclosed last night:

Quote
  • Starting Saturday, March 14, 2020, for all ships leaving Miami, we are further elevating our health measures, in line with the recommendation of the Cruise Line Association and the USA Government, therefore we will deny boarding for:
  •  
    • All guests with severe chronic medical condition (heart disease, diabetes, lung disease) as specified by the U.S. CDC
    • All guests 70 years of age or older at embarkation date or who turn 70 within the duration of  the cruise, unless provided written verification from their qualified treating physician certifying no severe chronic medical conditions and otherwise fit for the cruise
                                - We have already started thermal temperature check at all ports & gangway 
                                - We have already started weekly health screening for all crew members 
 
Important for European guests bound to the USA: 
  • Entry in USA is closed to most foreign nationals who have been in certain European countries at any point during the 14 days prior to their scheduled arrival to the United States. These countries include: Austria, Belgium, Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Malta, Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden, and Switzerland. This does not apply to legal permanent residents, (generally) immediate family members of U.S. citizens, and other individuals who are identified in the proclamation.  This restriction comes into effect at 11:59 p.m. eastern daylight time on March 13, 2020 and is expected to be in place for at least 30 days.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Point is safety for crew and passenger - even the over-70 being singled out.  Question becomes: will this become permanent after (hopefully there is an after) the corona virus has been tamed?  We had three b2b which now are cancelled, and we now see more and more ports denying entry.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, WAAAYTOOO said:

I still don’t see how they can enforce #2.  How would they possibly know whether I have any of those medical conditions or not ?  That’s a silly condition to place when they have no way of enforcing it.

Just sent a tweet to MSC Cruises and asked them whether there is a health form available to submit prior to boarding. My instinct is yes and similar to the one required by NCL

The other cruise lines can't be too far behind.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, WAAAYTOOO said:

I wonder if this questionnaire has to be signed a HCP.  If not, no reason to think people would be honest.

Not sure if you opened the link, but, yes, there is a space for a medical practitioner's signature, registration number, and a stamp of identification at the bottom. The practitioner's name, facility name is listed at the top.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Does anyone know if MSC is refunding $ (vs issuing FCC) to denied passengers under the new criteria?  Hoping RCCL might eventually do the same if they implement a similar policy.   Things  are getting really crazy with many cancellations in so many industries. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 hours ago, Bonnie Blake said:

So if we are over 70, do we need to provide a health certificate?

wait and see - we have been on many cruises (Diamond - one cruse away from Diamond Plus)  and spent lots of money - if that is the case we can spend our money someplace else - we have seen people that have to turn sideways to get in a door - do they need a health certificate? I guess we will discriminate against people for the good of who? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There are plenty of people with those conditions who are controlled and in good health, my husband and myself being two. It would put the kabash  on jumping in the car and driving to a close port on short notice. What doctor wants to go out on a limb in case you have a  heart attack on the ship and sue him for malpractice? I agree with PAJ! How many others have diabetes or heart disease and are under 70?  Age discrimination!?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, I was ok with how Royal was handling things until this latest announcement.  

Now they tell me I can’t cruise due to a chronic condition, but will still keep my money?  If my $ isn’t refunded and I’m forced to take FCC, I will never cruise with Royal again, once I use the FCC.  
Not only will they get the value of holding my $ for at least a year, prices for 2021 are ridiculously high compared to this year so I get less value for the same amount of money.   

 I know it’s a long shot but I’m hoping someone at royal reads this and similar posts and changes their mind re refunds. 
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you listen to Goldstein's TV interview he sort of lays this at the feet of Pence.  He suggests it was offered by the White House an idea of something the cruise lines could offer to do during their meeting.  Goldstein left Royal and is now CLIA exclusively.  CLIA offered this to the White House.  The cruise lines are following CLIA.  

Age discrimination came to mind.  Should be interesting to see how this plays out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I received an email this morning from RCCL stating that from Monday March 16th all persons aged 70 or older need to obtain doctors certification that they are fit to cruise before being allowed onboard. They issued the following template letter to take to my doctor for, would you believe, my cruise on Jewel of the Seas on Monday March 16th, which was cancelled a couple of days ago. ??

By the way, it takes 2-3 weeks to get such a letter from my doctor and they charge £30 for this. ?

image.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My wife and I are 70+. We both have conditions listed in the medical certification. But it asks the HCP to say that this person "does not suffer from any chronic illness (e.g. heart, lung, liver or kidney disease or immunodeficiency status due to HIV/AIDS or diabetes) which would make this patient susceptible to complications arising after infection with the Novel Coronavirus (2019-nCoV)/COVID-19."

What HCP is going to certify this? The potential liability is tremendous. 

So, we cancelled our Majesty cruise for 28 March from NO. If anyone needs a nice 1BR Grand Suite, there is one available. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

32 minutes ago, rjweber3 said:

My wife and I are 70+. We both have conditions listed in the medical certification. But it asks the HCP to say that this person "does not suffer from any chronic illness (e.g. heart, lung, liver or kidney disease or immunodeficiency status due to HIV/AIDS or diabetes) which would make this patient susceptible to complications arising after infection with the Novel Coronavirus (2019-nCoV)/COVID-19."

What HCP is going to certify this? The potential liability is tremendous. 

So, we cancelled our Majesty cruise for 28 March from NO. If anyone needs a nice 1BR Grand Suite, there is one available. 

To clarify why they want HCP to certify as you can have a certain listed condition but it may not be chronic but might be acute:

- Acute conditions are severe and sudden in onset. This could describe anything from a broken bone to an asthma attack.

- Chronic condition, by contrast is a long-developing syndrome, such as osteoporosis or asthma.

** Note that osteoporosis, a chronic condition, may cause a broken bone, an acute condition.

Hope this helps clarify things.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Jim S said:

I received an email this morning from RCCL stating that from Monday March 16th all persons aged 70 or older need to obtain doctors certification that they are fit to cruise before being allowed onboard. They issued the following template letter to take to my doctor for, would you believe, my cruise on Jewel of the Seas on Monday March 16th, which was cancelled a couple of days ago. ??

By the way, it takes 2-3 weeks to get such a letter from my doctor and they charge £30 for this. ?

image.png

I had a patient this morning present this to me at his appointment.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Jolly Ogre said:

I had a patient this morning present this to me at his appointment.

I took the letter to my doctor today and he refused to sign it. He had no problem in confirming that I was not suffering from any of the listed chronic illnesses but he said he could not attest to me being fit to travel on a cruise ship since the UK government had issued guidance to all over 70’s advising not to travel on a cruise ship. Looks like I will not be allowed to travel on our March 23 cruise. ??

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, Jim S said:

I took the letter to my doctor today and he refused to sign it. He had no problem in confirming that I was not suffering from any of the listed chronic illnesses but he said he could not attest to me being fit to travel on a cruise ship since the UK government had issued guidance to all over 70’s advising not to travel on a cruise ship. Looks like I will not be allowed to travel on our March 23 cruise. ??

So sorry.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Jim S said:

I took the letter to my doctor today and he refused to sign it. He had no problem in confirming that I was not suffering from any of the listed chronic illnesses but he said he could not attest to me being fit to travel on a cruise ship since the UK government had issued guidance to all over 70’s advising not to travel on a cruise ship. Looks like I will not be allowed to travel on our March 23 cruise. ??

Sorry to hear that. We have to evaluate our pts individually and when we do things like this it is not because we don't care, its because we do care.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Jolly Ogre said:

Sorry to hear that. We have to evaluate our pts individually and when we do things like this it is not because we don't care, its because we do care.

You sound like a great physician and human being, Dr. Ogre, I loved what you said. 

Thank you ? 

My sister is a nurse, so I have the upmost respect for people who work in health care.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Jolly Ogre said:

I had a patient this morning present this to me at his appointment.

Without violating any confidentiality issues, can you tell us how you handled it ?  I would think that it would be difficult, much like @Jim S said, to make such a broad statement.  Interesting, from the Physician’s perspective.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/13/2020 at 3:17 PM, WAAAYTOOO said:

Without violating any confidentiality issues, can you tell us how you handled it ?  I would think that it would be difficult, much like @Jim S said, to make such a broad statement.  Interesting, from the Physician’s perspective.

We have to evaluate our pts individually and make decisions on a case by case basis.

In his case he was ok to travel, however RCCL has canceled his cruise now, so the point is moot.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

OK, here's a probability for me (72 yrs old with mild COPD).  We're booked for April 26 and I know my Doctor will not accept liability by signing a letter stating that I'm not at risk.  So RCCL gives me a FCC.  If my Doctor won't sign now, it's even less likely he'll sign in the future.  What good is a FCC if you're never able to use it?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is just a personal opinion....based on nothing more than common sense.  It is my belief that the "Dr. note" scenario will quietly slip away.  It might have sounded like a reasonable plan when some bean counter devised it, but honestly, it's not workable.  As you said, MOST doctors are not going to declare that a passenger is "fit to cruise" - there's no way to truly verify that.  What does it even mean ?  It's too broad of a declaration.  If they quietly change the form to remove that declaration and only ask the HCP to verify any chronic ongoing health issues, it might work.  Then the passenger could sign a statement not to hold the cruise line liable (I also realize those are not worth the paper they are printed on) and leave it at that.  There is always risk for both the passenger and the cruise line.  Ship happens.  But this Dr. note thing is not workable in the big scheme.  IMO.  Is this REALLY the time to be asking HCP to sign silly waivers for cruisers ?  I think they have waaay more important things to do right now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, WAAAYTOOO said:

This is just a personal opinion....based on nothing more than common sense.  It is my belief that the "Dr. note" scenario will quietly slip away.  It might have sounded like a reasonable plan when some bean counter devised it, but honestly, it's not workable.

I thought the doctor note thing was devised by the CLIA to appease the government so they could continue to operate.  I can see it going away eventually as the situation improves and life goes back to normal, but it may linger a bit even after cruising resumes to, again, appease the government so they can start back up again.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

41 minutes ago, AshleyDillo said:

I thought the doctor note thing was devised by the CLIA to appease the government so they could continue to operate.  I can see it going away eventually as the situation improves and life goes back to normal, but it may linger a bit even after cruising resumes to, again, appease the government so they can start back up again.

That is also what I have read....so it may have to be "OKed" by the CLIA to get it removed.  I still think it is completely impractical and a bit discriminatory.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...