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MattCasey

Freedom of the Seas Fatality?

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2 hours ago, PG Cruiser said:

I am not a lawyer but what I'm seeing here is that the lawyer will argue that had Royal "adhered to window fall prevention laws designed to protect children", the negligent grandfather would not have had the chance to cause the death of his grandchild.  They'd say, "If there were no open windows there, the accident could not have happened."

My two cents ...

 

Yes, they'll argue that just because the grandfather (i.e. grandmother's boyfriend) was negligent, it doesn't relieve the cruise line from (their perceived) negligence.  This sleazy family will still go after their blood money.  

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22 minutes ago, princevaliantus said:

Grandfather of toddler who died in cruise ship fall is pleading guilty to end 'nightmare'!!

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/grandfather-toddler-who-died-falling-cruise-ship-plead-guilty-her-n1142981

Now that Grandfather admits fault, the Civil Suit gets diminished, if not, dismissed against RCCL!!

The grandfather did not admit fault, nor does the plea speak to any details of his actions regarding the incident. The civil case will be FULL steam ahead. 
In reality this plea deal will be beneficial to Winkelman and his crusade against Royal, as any chances of a negative discovery during criminal proceedings has been eliminated. 

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21 minutes ago, princevaliantus said:

Now that Grandfather admits fault, the Civil Suit gets diminished, if not, dismissed against RCCL!!

I'm not sure the guilty plea will diminish the Civil Suit.   They'll argue that the open window on the 11th deck of the Freedom made the accident possible.

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3 hours ago, tiny blonde said:

He is not admitting to the facts, but he is accepting the guilty plea, which means he is saying, "Guilty."

But there are rules as to how such pleas are allowed to be used in the courtroom.  It is not as simple as common sense would dictate. I am familiar with a simplified version of the Federal Rules of Evidence so I will differ to a lawyer who is familiar with the rules of evidence in PR.  A guilty plea hear does not necessarily mean a spam dunk for the civil case. (I’ll do a little more research)

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42 minutes ago, TXcruzer said:

The grandfather did not admit fault, nor does the plea speak to any details of his actions regarding the incident. The civil case will be FULL steam ahead. 
In reality this plea deal will be beneficial to Winkelman and his crusade against Royal, as any chances of a negative discovery during criminal proceedings has been eliminated. 

38 minutes ago, PG Cruiser said:

I'm not sure the guilty plea will diminish the Civil Suit.   They'll argue that the open window on the 11th deck of the Freedom made the accident possible.

When you take a plea, you are at fault 100%. The grandfather will be changing his plea. This is not a "nolo contendere" plea and was not stated as such by his attorney. Once he makes his allocution to the Court, it's done. Then, comes the Civil matter, since Grandfather has taken fault in his allocution to the Court, Civil AND Criminal proceedings run parallel, inasmuch, liability false on the Grandfather and diminishes on RCCL. There is also a sense of Comparative Negligence that RCCL might still have to argue/fight in court before a jury and/or settle. Please do your research and have legal a background as I do. I don't state falsehoods. Too many "jailhouse" lawyers on this site.

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5 minutes ago, princevaliantus said:

 Please do your research and have legal a background as I do. I don't state falsehoods. Too many "jailhouse" lawyers on this site.

I thought we were having a discussion here.  I didn't realize only the experts can chime in.  Just to let you know, most of your posts on this forum have that tone in them.

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1 minute ago, PG Cruiser said:

I thought we were having a discussion here.  I didn't realize only the experts can chime in.  Just to let you know, most of your posts on this forum have that tone in them.

Never assume, as the saying goes. Just stating facts. No Mal-intent behind it. No caps were used. Just coming from someone with a legal background.

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After some more research, a guilty plea is admissible but it does not automatically mean that he is liable. He will have a chance to explain his reasoning for that guilty plea.  It would be up to the jury to determine how that guilty plea will be used in their decision making process. 

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1 minute ago, StayFrosty said:

After some more research, a guilty plea is admissible but it does not automatically mean that he is liable. He will have a chance to explain his reasoning for that guilty plea.  It would be up to the jury to determine how that guilty plea will be used in their decision making process. 

There is no jury when you plea out to charges. A plea is an agreement made by both sides and overseen/agreed to by the Court. The Court has final say whether it will accept defendant's plea and the recommendation of the prosecution.

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6 minutes ago, StayFrosty said:

I was talking about using the guilty plea in the civil case that I am assuming would have a jury. 

Oh ok. Two parts in a Civil action. Liability and then Damages. Grandfather gets on the stand and says he held granddaughter over railing. Moreover, RCCL's Counsel will bring up his allocution, and once the jury hears he accepted responsibility by his plea in the Criminal action, the jury will have to decide if Grandfather is 100% or if there is Comparative Negligence by RCCL, which will most likely be minimal. In addition, RCCL can bring in Grandfather in the Civil action as a Third-Party action.

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Interesting.  That’s what NC had when I was in law school (and still may).   Back in the ‘80s, in NC the standard was that any degree of contributory negligence meant no collection for the plaintiff (unless the defendant had the “last clear chance” to avoid the accident.  I can’t see how that applies here but there almost has to be a bit of contributory negligence.  However, does Puerto Rico law or Florida law control?    I think Florida is a comparative negligence state.  

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1 hour ago, Fairlynew said:

Interesting.  That’s what NC had when I was in law school (and still may).   Back in the ‘80s, in NC the standard was that any degree of contributory negligence meant no collection for the plaintiff (unless the defendant had the “last clear chance” to avoid the accident.  I can’t see how that applies here but there almost has to be a bit of contributory negligence.  However, does Puerto Rico law or Florida law control?    I think Florida is a comparative negligence state.  

Since the venue will be somewhere in Florida, that's where the jurisdiction lies.

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There is absolutely nothing good that will come from this tragedy, but I just saw this on FB, and 

it just enhances what we all already know - that man was fully aware that the window was open.

https://bcaeagles.com/2020/02/04/new-video-shows-moments-before-toddler-fell-to-her-death-on-royal-caribbean/?fbclid=IwAR0ldijxsRj_wts6BbYim8RIyhr7xlVBBY8oSmT0VelZe5v2CFEmwdV8JnQ

 

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