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MattCasey

Freedom of the Seas Fatality?

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1 hour ago, PattiHere said:

Sadly there is a part of me that feels the grandfather planned this. It appears to me on the video that he took his time walking to the window, leaning over and looking out the window, then picking up his granddaughter and putting her life in danger, knowing the window was open and it was a long drop to the ground.  So sorry for these feelings, but my heart is with this little girl and the last seconds of her short life.  The more the family pushes “it was the cruise lines fault” the more I begin to wonder if it really was.   Now the lawyer wants the videos dismissed!  

Of course the lawyer wants the videos dismissed! This lawsuit is going to be a very fierce battle. BTW, I have had the nagging thought, as well, that the grandfather planned it, that he thought he'd be doing the family a favor by ending the life of this special-needs child, whose care and education was going to cost more money. She was probably the star of the family, and maybe was the center of his wife's attention, and they may have argued about money. I think I (or someone) could write a great mystery novel about a possible backstory.

 

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4 hours ago, tiny blonde said:

Of course the lawyer wants the videos dismissed! This lawsuit is going to be a very fierce battle.

I for one am very glad that in this particular instance, Royal is not simply "rolling over" and going directly to arbitration. I'm betting the lawyer firmly believed this is what they'd do based on his past experience, and wasn't banking on Royal having such comprehensive and damning video of the whole event. Instead, after having their reputation dragged through the mud by him and this family, Royal appears to have decided to go to the mat with this slime ball and the family that he's roped in. They pushed too hard and too fast and left Royal with no real choice but to take this all the way through and clear their own name.

And if / when Royal wins, you can bet the family will be paying the slime ball for all of his legal fees and related expenses. He will come out on top (financially, anyway) no matter what. Royal already appears to be turning around the court of public opinion, and (sadly) that is probably the biggest part nowadays of being able to then win in the court of law.

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32 minutes ago, JLMoran said:

And if / when Royal wins, you can bet the family will be paying the slime ball for all of his legal fees and related expenses. He will come out on top (financially, anyway) no matter what. 

I hope he took on the case pro bono where he won't get paid unless he wins.  Not that I want the family to avoid having to pay him out of pocket, but I want the atty to not be paid at all even more.

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The following is an except from an article on the Fox News website.

 

Michael Winkleman, an attorney for the Wiegands, has since called Royal Caribbean’s motion to dismiss “baseless.”

“It is clear that Royal Caribbean’s tactic is to blame Chloe’s grandfather rather than to accept that Royal Caribbean did not implement industry standards for toddler safety aboard its ships which ultimately led to Chloe’s tragic death,” Winkleman said, in part, in a statement shared with Fox 43.

Winkleman further claimed that Royal Caribbean was supplying “two deceptive views from its CCTV cameras.”

On Friday, attorneys for the family filed two further motions: one to strike the video footage, claiming the "the authenticity of the videos" had not been established; and another asking the court to make Royal Caribbean "to produce all video footage from all of the cameras," of which Winkleman had said there were 13 in total.

 

The video footage seems pretty conclusive in my eyes. Even allowing for camera angles the grandfather was a long way outside the window. He would have banged his head on the glass if the window was closed.

The court would have received the videos directly from Royal Caribbean so I don't believe you can dispute their authenticity without implying some kind of conspiracy occurring in the background.

I suppose if you can exclude all the evidence that proves something to be true then anything is possible.

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We all filter what we see with our own emotions and interpretations. Our minds need to interpret what we see. Unfortunately, the family might not be able to emotionally accept what we see. If RC is not to blame then the reality of what the grandfather did might be too much for them to handle now and possibly always.

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I am so baffled that anyone is defending the parents and grandfather at this point. Granted that number is shrinking with the video evidence being loud and clear, but I can only think that anyone taking the family’s side knows them. Mom and Dad have to be the dumbest prosecutor and cop in the country to ask that the surveillance be thrown out. I don’t even care about their feelings at this point. 

Lots of people have gone to jail for not meaning to kill someone. Why should the grandfather get off? What if he had sent a text while driving and Chloe died in the backseat? Should he still get off just because he feels sad? 

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11 minutes ago, WoodsCommaElle said:

I am so baffled that anyone is defending the parents and grandfather at this point. Granted that number is shrinking with the video evidence being loud and clear, but I can only think that anyone taking the family’s side knows them. Mom and Dad have to be the dumbest prosecutor and cop in the country to ask that the surveillance be thrown out. I don’t even care about their feelings at this point. 

Lots of people have gone to jail for not meaning to kill someone. Why should the grandfather get off? What if he had sent a text while driving and Chloe died in the backseat? Should he still get off just because he feels sad? 

Asking to get the video thrown out is a standard legal maneuver, and if any reason can be found to rule out the authenticity of the videos, they will be thrown out. It happens all the time. Evidence found on improperly executed search warrants, for example, are not allowed in testimony. It has nothing to do with guilt or innocence, it's about the lawyer trying to get his client acquitted, which is the lawyer's job. 

While I'm on the subject, a jury's findings actually have nothing to do with actual guilt or innocence, as is demonstrated by the large number of people in prison who did not commit the crime for which they were convicted. A jury's verdict has to do with their understanding of the law as it is explained to them, and their opinion (not the facts) regarding whether the defendant broke the law.

So it's not a just system, only the best system we have, and lots better than when the people of Salem used to dunk witches in the ocean, figuring that if they were innocent, they wouldn't drown. We still have a lot of room for improvement. If the jurors feel there is room for doubt, they will acquit, even if grandpa actually planned to murder the child.

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So now the family wants the CCTV recorded images of the tragedy dropped because the CCTV camera lied! They want to continue to insist that window ledge on the 11th floor of the ship is a baby play area! And the grandpa who is supposedly working as IT man and drives cars, cannot tell whether the window is open? If the video gets thrown out and he gets acquitted, I think our justice system would need total overhaul. They are all for the money before even the child body turn cold. He should go to jail and the parents should get nothing!

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I wonder if grandpa has ever come back to his car in a snow storm and found his car full of snow because he didn't know his window was open?

Probably has a wicked air conditioning bill in the summer when the windows in the house are open.  

Drive through restaurants must be a PITA for him.  Is the window open or not?  So confusing.

Is he a Mac IT professional because Windows seems to give him a lot of trouble.

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I was standing by an open window on deck 11 as Adventure docked in San Juan today. 
 

I counted 11 different people talking about this incident , and all of them thought his story is bs.  
 

I had forgotten just how far it is from the wooden railing to the window ledge. I could stand between the two. It would be a tight squeeze, and the footing would suck, but there’s enough room for my body  

I have never minded heights, but when I bent out the window like I saw in the above video, I was a bit uncomfortable. 

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3 hours ago, teddy said:

 

I had forgotten just how far it is from the wooden railing to the window ledge. I could stand between the two. It would be a tight squeeze, and the footing would suck, but there’s enough room for my body  

This information accompanied with the video, and the photo from @F1guynz reminds me of how much room is there!  I never doubted that RCCL was not at fault especially when you are able to see the tinting to the windows, and decipher which windows are open or closed even from being on land.  As has already been mentioned it is not hard to tell which ones are open or closed when you are onboard due to the noise level as well as the wind.  Both which the grandfather should have heard, and felt prior to him even sticking his head out of the window as the video shows.  At this point there is NO justification for what he has done and he and his family need to come to the realization that none of this is going to bring their precious daughter back.  They need to spend as much time healing from this horrible tragedy as they are putting into trying to defame/blame RCCL!!!  

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Based on the height of the railing I would say one of the reasons it is there is prevent adults from leaning out the windows and falling out. Reason enough not to put a child up there.

Also when the window is open you can see all the window runners so I suspect if you asked 10,000 adults 9,999 would be able to tell it was open.

 

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We boarded Adventure just a day or two after this unfortunate situation.  Everyone was discussing this everyday.  Everyone had the same reaction...that handrail is far enough out that any sane minded person would say....hmmm.  handrail by window, WARNING, danger!   You don't need tinted windows.  The handrail should be a big enough warning.

What drives me crazy about the parents is if they are anything like my son nd his wife,  they are nothing like when we raised our kids regarding safety.  I am 54.  No sleeping with pillows until a certain age, crib bumpers have to be a certain fabric.  Switching car seats from one car to another is a process/ordeal.  Check, double check to make sure it is tethered properly.  I believe I am an intelligent woman, but I cower with my kids....can I do this or that with their child?  

Hence, as a grandparent, I really don't get the family.  How on earth, with this video, did he think oh I just bent my body 90 degrees over a railing to look out, so lets have the baby, at best, stand on the railing.  

My hubby and I discussed this on a car ride this past weekend.  We both agreed that if we did this as a grandparent, we would have to be on a suicide watch.  I could never get over it.  There would be nothing in my life to live for.  Please, no flaming me.  I am just saying emotionally I could never get past this pain and guilt.

If I was working in the PR dept for RCL.  Whatever ends with the lawsuit, win or lose, I would tell them to publicly offer the family, every family member lifetime psychological counseling regardless of the cost to the company.  

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We were also on Adventure and was wondering the same if Freedom is set up the same as Adventure as in the photo shown above by @F1guynz ?  Is this a picture of Freedom?  This is what it looked like on Adventure and I didn't understand how the grandfather could put the baby on the rail and not know the window was there...and how the child was leaning over enough?  But thought maybe that is not the set up on Freedom and it was simply the window opening. 

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Knowing what I do about the legal system and the way people's minds work, I predict that if Grandpa is found guilty in the criminal trial (and I hope he is), the family will cry, "Unfair!" and they'll appeal, and forever believe that it was RCCL's fault. It's far more comfortable than accepting the truth, which is too horrible.

I wonder how Grandma and Grandpa's marriage is doing, and how it was before this. If I felt like spending a couple of years writing a novel, I can cook up a terrific backstory here!

 

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