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Give Me Liberty, or ...not. An Insurance Claim Live Blog


twangster

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19 hours ago, karl_nj said:

My concern with the Chase Sapphire Reserve travel insurance is that it doesn't seem to cover any airline delays other then weather (and strike).  It doesn't appear to cover any other reason why you wouldn't be able to fly... involuntary bumping, mechanical issue, 737-MAX grounding, etc:

https://www.chase.com/card-benefits/sapphirereserve/travel

What’s Not Covered

This is not an exhaustive list. Examples include:

  • Travel arrangements canceled or changed by a common carrier, tour operator, or any travel agency unless the cancellation is the result of severe weather or an organized strike affecting public transportation

 

I feel it's enough coverage when am I driving to the port, but it seems lacking for flying.

 

Airline delays such as mechanical, strike are covered by the DOT’s protections so the Airline already has to compensate you for those flights. 

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1 minute ago, Andrew72681 said:

Airline delays such as mechanical, strike are covered by the DOT’s protections so the Airline already has to compensate you for those flights. 

 

Yes, but the airline won't compensate me for the cruise if the airline is unable to get me to the cruise on time.  Just the flight.

$250/per person for the flight doesn't really help if i'm out an additional $1500/person for the cruise.

 

What is not covered by Trip Interruption insurance?

...

Additionally, this insurance does not apply to any Accident, Accidental Bodily Injury or loss caused by or resulting from, directly or indirectly: 1) Common Carrier caused delays, unless they are as a result of an organized strike that affects public transportation; 2) travel arrangements canceled or changed by a Common Carrier, Tour Operator, or any travel agent unless the cancellation is the result of severe weather or an organized strike affecting public transportation;

 

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@twangster this is bringing up awful memories of our dealings with Allianz last August.  We had to cancel our Europe trip 6 days in.  We decided there was no way we'd cancel just to cancel so we bought the classic plan.  Then my 15 year old attempted suicide while we were gone.  Allianz made every step difficult along the way and finally denied everything.  We lost over 10000.  We could have hired an attorney and tried to submit claims that were worded differently but in the end we just couldn't put that much effort in.  And this is what happens.  The insurance companies make you file and refile in hopes you give up every step of the way.  And you are organized...God help the unorganized traveler with no screenshots or documentation.  I understand... They are a business and their purpose is to make money but somewhere customer satisfaction and PR has to play a role in it 

   We have just bought cancel for any reason coverage through Allianz for our Cuba trip in 65 days.  If Havana gets canceleled as a port, I'm sure majesty will sail anyway and since the rest of the trip involves hotel rooms and we would never be able to book a cruise and airfare for similar price, we will probably just take wherever Royal decides to go and not even try the cancel insurance.  

   I know I would never be able to always fly and arrive 24 hrs before...I'm lucky I can do the night before on Saturday cruises.  Ugh.  The whole thing stresses me out.  

   I'm so sorry that this has been such an awful process and I hope you have better luck with the appeal.  Jane

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8 hours ago, mom2mybugs said:

@twangster this is bringing up awful memories of our dealings with Allianz last August.  We had to cancel our Europe trip 6 days in.  We decided there was no way we'd cancel just to cancel so we bought the classic plan.  Then my 15 year old attempted suicide while we were gone.  Allianz made every step difficult along the way and finally denied everything.  We lost over 10000.  We could have hired an attorney and tried to submit claims that were worded differently but in the end we just couldn't put that much effort in.  And this is what happens.  The insurance companies make you file and refile in hopes you give up every step of the way.  And you are organized...God help the unorganized traveler with no screenshots or documentation.  I understand... They are a business and their purpose is to make money but somewhere customer satisfaction and PR has to play a role in it 

   We have just bought cancel for any reason coverage through Allianz for our Cuba trip in 65 days.  If Havana gets canceleled as a port, I'm sure majesty will sail anyway and since the rest of the trip involves hotel rooms and we would never be able to book a cruise and airfare for similar price, we will probably just take wherever Royal decides to go and not even try the cancel insurance.  

   I know I would never be able to always fly and arrive 24 hrs before...I'm lucky I can do the night before on Saturday cruises.  Ugh.  The whole thing stresses me out.  

   I'm so sorry that this has been such an awful process and I hope you have better luck with the appeal.  Jane

I realize Allianz is a large bank also but, these guys are just plain greedy after reading all of this so far.

Fourth-quarter net profit was 1.70 billion euros ($1.92 billion) compared with EUR1.43 billion a year earlier, the company said Friday.

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On ‎4‎/‎19‎/‎2019 at 2:02 PM, Andrew72681 said:

See if you can make the automated system explode, just respond with things that confuse the system, after all it never said integers only, so maybe try the first ten thousand digits of pi? 

That number would be too high. Certainly doesn't deserve a 3+ based on what we've read.

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@twangsterI'm an optimist. I think you will prevail. Here's why. Simply, you appealed. My last claim was initially denied by IMG. I, too, had documentation that I didn't realize would be relevant. I contacted the appeals representative at itravelinsured.com, where I purchase all my travel insurance, and they got the ball rolling for me and notified me via email, phone call, AND mail that my denial had been reversed and that I was receiving what was due to me. Was VERY pleased with the service I received. Also, with itravelinsured, they helped me find a policy for a cruise over 2 years away. I didn't want to wait for our usual policy selection to be available as I wanted to get the "Cancel for Any Reason" and pre-existing conditions added. iTravelinsured.com made that happen. I've been using them for almost 10 years.

Edit to add: I also start coverage, the date and is effective date, when we drive out of our garage. So, even driving (the day before) to St. Louis for flight, is covered (not just the flight) but getting to STL which is about 1 hr 45 min from my garage.

Edited by Baked Alaska
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Ok in a ridiculous side note to insurance issues...we just got required to prove to my husbands work insurance that the kids and I should be insured.   It’s all to keep our costs down of course but I had to submit not only the kids birth certificates but also a copy of our 29 year old marriage license.  A clerk signed filed copy, not a church one.  And file by May 14!   How many people will miss that?   Yesterday I got the letter making Jeff sign to confirm any other outside insurance doesn’t exist....OMG!!!!!    Jane

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1 minute ago, mom2mybugs said:

Ok in a ridiculous side note to insurance issues...we just got required to prove to my husbands work insurance that the kids and I should be insured.   It’s all to keep our costs down of course but I had to submit not only the kids birth certificates but also a copy of our 29 year old marriage license.  A clerk signed filed copy, not a church one.  And file by May 14!   How many people will miss that?   Yesterday I got the letter making Jeff sign to confirm any other outside insurance doesn’t exist....OMG!!!!!    Jane

For trip insurance?!

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On ‎4‎/‎20‎/‎2019 at 2:18 PM, SweetPea said:

We no longer buy travel insurance since we got the Chase Sapphire Reserve card. Your report made me go through the details of their travel protection you get automatically when you use the card to pay for travel, and I found nothing about a 24 hour rule for airport closure.

This is probably open to wild interpretation though:

 

Chase Sapphire Reserve card - $450.00 Annual Fee!!!!!  HOLY SMOKES!!

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32 minutes ago, Andrew72681 said:

Yeah, but 300 of that comes back in a travel credit, it includes a priority pass membership, and more. 

Yeah, exactly.  Between that and the insurance, we get our $$ back and then some. They have other nice perks too. Made sense for us since we travel a lot. :1_grinning:

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2 hours ago, SweetPea said:

Yeah, exactly.  Between that and the insurance, we get our $$ back and then some. They have other nice perks too. Made sense for us since we travel a lot. :1_grinning:

Already having the priority pass for other cards the reserve never made sense for me, I’ve kept the preferred in my wallet for five years now, but the new Amex gold means it’s gathering dust in there now. 

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6 hours ago, SweetPea said:

Yeah, exactly.  Between that and the insurance, we get our $$ back and then some. They have other nice perks too. Made sense for us since we travel a lot. :1_grinning:

I always love to hear people’s definitions of  “a lot”, I’ve got six flights next week and five the week after. I’m 58 nights into my 75 with Marriott for the year so should make that by the end of May. 

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10 hours ago, Andrew72681 said:

I always love to hear people’s definitions of  “a lot”, I’ve got six flights next week and five the week after. I’m 58 nights into my 75 with Marriott for the year so should make that by the end of May. 

Sounds like you're in Sales.

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24 minutes ago, SweetPea said:

You win. 

Winning is subjective. I always assumed I’d learn how to sleep well in hotel beds. But even nine years in and about a thousand nights I still haven’t figured it out. 

It just means I can meet bonus spend thresholds faster with business expenses. On my last Amex bonus I made it in one transaction buying Syndicated grocery data. 

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4 minutes ago, Andrew72681 said:

Winning is subjective. I always assumed I’d learn how to sleep well in hotel beds. But even nine years in and about a thousand nights I still haven’t figured it out. 

It just means I can meet bonus spend thresholds faster with business expenses. On my last Amex bonus I made it in one transaction buying Syndicated grocery data. 

How did this thread become about who has the travels the most / has the most nights / best credit card for travel?!?!?

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39 minutes ago, marti314 said:

How did this thread become about who has the travels the most / has the most nights / best credit card for travel?!?!?

Agreed! I'm still wondering if any of these fancy schmancy travel credit cards have Cancel For Any Reason included in their policies, given thread is about travel insurance.

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3 minutes ago, Baked Alaska said:

Agreed! I'm still wondering if any of these fancy schmancy travel credit cards have Cancel For Any Reason included in their policies, given thread is about travel insurance.

No. No credit card I’ve heard of has CFAR, even with separate travel insurance that’s hard to come by at any decent price. 

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7 hours ago, Andrew72681 said:

No. No credit card I’ve heard of has CFAR, even with separate travel insurance that’s hard to come by at any decent price. 

 

In addition, most cancel for any reason plans only cover 50% to 75% of the cost.  And you generally have to cancel a couple of days in advance --  so even if this twangster scenareo happened ot someone who had this coverage, they would have been denied for CFAR anyway.

 

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1 minute ago, karl_nj said:

 

In addition, most cancel for any reason plans only cover 50% to 75% of the cost.  And you generally have to cancel a couple of days in advance --  so even if this twangster scenareo happened ot someone who had this coverage, they would have been denied for CFAR anyway.

 

MMmmmm. No. My CFAR, if you will, ends embarkation day (and trip interruption starts with all the medical and other coverages). Have used it twice. 75% back is better than 0%.

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2 minutes ago, Baked Alaska said:

MMmmmm. No. My CFAR, if you will, ends embarkation day (and trip interruption starts with all the medical and other coverages). Have used it twice. 75% back is better than 0%.

 

Maybe it depends on the state? When I looked up the policy for Travel LX in NJ, there seems to be a "donut hole" where Cancel For Any Reason requires 2 days before the departure date, and Interruption For Any Reason doesn't kick in until 2 days after the departure date.  Not sure what coverage there is in the middle.  I could just be reading it wrong.

https://www.itravelinsured.com/forms/iTIPolicyWording_T210-IP-LX-0417.pdf

 

Cancel for Any Reason Benefit

If You cancel Your Trip for any reason not otherwise covered by this Policy, benefits will be paid for seventy-fivepercent (75%) of the Prepaid, forfeited, non-refundable Payments or Deposits You paid for Your Trip provided:(a) Your Payment or Deposit for this Policy and enrollment form are received twenty (20) days of the date Your initial Payment or Deposit for Your Trip is received; and;(b) You insure one hundred percent (100%) of the Prepaid Trip costs that are subject to cancellation penalties or restrictions and also insure within twenty (20) days of the Payment or Deposit for those Travel Arrangements the cost of any subsequent Travel Arrangements (or any other Travel Arrangements not made through Your travel agent) added to Your Trip; and(c) You cancel Your Trip two (2) days or more before Your Scheduled Departure Date.These benefits will not duplicate any other benefits payable under the Policy or any coverage(s) attached to the Policy.

Interruption for Any Reason Benefit

If You interrupt Your Trip, forty-eight (48) hours or more after Your actual Departure Date, for any reason not otherwise covered by this Policy, benefits will be paid, up to: seventy-five percent (75%) of the total amount of coverage You purchased, to reimburse You for the Prepaid Payments or Deposits for unused non-refundable land or water Travel Arrangements.These benefits will not duplicate any other benefits payable under the Policy or any coverage(s) attached to the Policy.

 

The more I read the fine print on all of this insurance, the less I want to purchase it in the future ?

 

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37 minutes ago, karl_nj said:

 

Maybe it depends on the state? When I looked up the policy for Travel LX in NJ, there seems to be a "donut hole" where Cancel For Any Reason requires 2 days before the departure date, and Interruption For Any Reason doesn't kick in until 2 days after the departure date.  Not sure what coverage there is in the middle.  I could just be reading it wrong.

https://www.itravelinsured.com/forms/iTIPolicyWording_T210-IP-LX-0417.pdf

 

Cancel for Any Reason Benefit

If You cancel Your Trip for any reason not otherwise covered by this Policy, benefits will be paid for seventy-fivepercent (75%) of the Prepaid, forfeited, non-refundable Payments or Deposits You paid for Your Trip provided:(a) Your Payment or Deposit for this Policy and enrollment form are received twenty (20) days of the date Your initial Payment or Deposit for Your Trip is received; and;(b) You insure one hundred percent (100%) of the Prepaid Trip costs that are subject to cancellation penalties or restrictions and also insure within twenty (20) days of the Payment or Deposit for those Travel Arrangements the cost of any subsequent Travel Arrangements (or any other Travel Arrangements not made through Your travel agent) added to Your Trip; and(c) You cancel Your Trip two (2) days or more before Your Scheduled Departure Date.These benefits will not duplicate any other benefits payable under the Policy or any coverage(s) attached to the Policy.

Interruption for Any Reason Benefit

If You interrupt Your Trip, forty-eight (48) hours or more after Your actual Departure Date, for any reason not otherwise covered by this Policy, benefits will be paid, up to: seventy-five percent (75%) of the total amount of coverage You purchased, to reimburse You for the Prepaid Payments or Deposits for unused non-refundable land or water Travel Arrangements.These benefits will not duplicate any other benefits payable under the Policy or any coverage(s) attached to the Policy.

 

The more I read the fine print on all of this insurance, the less I want to purchase it in the future ?

 

Go back to page 4, Section II, Trip Cancellation, this part would cover those 48 hours before your trip (I, too, am looking at your NJ doc for discussion, not my state, ). Then, there is the Cancel for Any Reason which is separate from this previously mentioned coverage. The CFAR is for ANY reason. . . dog died, garbage disposal blew up, ANY (yes, even stupid) reason. Yep, if your dog dies within 48 hours of travel, then too bad, you're going on vacation. Forty-nine hours earlier, you could have made your claim. Regarding the 48 hours after the start of your trip, Missed Connection or Travel Delay would kick in, here, to JOIN your trip. If you have to stop your trip, look further into the reasons to leave the tour/cruise (check out page 6 under "Other Covered Reasons"). 

Adding to Edit: I will call my agent and pose your questions to her and update later. I love picking apart these docs. Yes, I like to do taxes, too. It's an illness, I guess.

Edited by Baked Alaska
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12 minutes ago, Baked Alaska said:

Go back to page 4, Section II, Trip Cancellation, this part would cover those 48 hours before your trip (I, too, am looking at your NJ doc for discussion, not my state, ). Then, there is the Cancel for Any Reason which is separate from this previously mentioned coverage. The CFAR is for ANY reason. . . dog died, garbage disposal blew up, ANY (yes, even stupid) reason. Yep, if your dog dies within 48 hours of travel, then too bad, you're going on vacation. Forty-nine hours earlier, you could have made your claim. Regarding the 48 hours after the start of your trip, Missed Connection or Travel Delay would kick in, here, to JOIN your trip. If you have to stop your trip, look further into the reasons to leave the tour/cruise (check out page 6 under "Other Covered Reasons"). 

Adding to Edit: I will call my agent and pose your questions to her and update later. I love picking apart these docs. Yes, I like to do taxes, too. It's an illness, I guess.

I think the key bit is that Cancel for Any Reason is different then Interruption for Any Reason, and you found a rare policy that covers both.  I didn't even know that existed.  Looks like Travel Insured may also have this special coverage.

So if your dog isn't getting along with the other dogs in the Kennel, you can come home early.  But you need to give Fido 2 days to try to adjust before you give up on the trip.

And the other key bit we have learned is that every policy is slightly different, and it pays to read the fine print.

The aggravating part is that twangster also seems like a person who reads the fine print, and is very careful with details, but he is still having issues with his claim.

 

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Royal's coverage is provided by Aon and Arch.  Coverage varies by state, you can enter your state here to see what applies in your home state:

https://www.archinsurancesolutions.com/coverage/Royal

For Colorado it includes two versions of cancellation coverage. 

In my case it appears the second "Any Reason" coverage would have provided a 75% cruise credit since I had time to notify them prior to the ship's departure.

 

The first cancellation coverage applies to a select few covered reason and reimburses at 100% in cash. 

  • Cancellation Penalty Waiver.…............................................................Cash Refund Up To Total Cruise Vacation Cost This Cancellation Penalty Waiver is an addendum to your cruise ticket contract. Through the Travel Protection Program, Royal Caribbean International will waive their standard cancellation provision and refund to you IN CASH the otherwise non-refundable value of the unused portion of your prepaid cruise vacation, should you or your traveling companion need to cancel your cruise vacation for any one of the following reasons (subject to the restrictions noted below*).
  1. sickness, injury, or death of yourself, a traveling companion or members of either of your immediate families, which is diagnosed and treated by a physician at the time your cruise vacation is terminated;
  2. involvement in a traffic accident, en route to departure, that causes you to miss your cruise;
  3. your home is made uninhabitable by a natural disaster such as fire, flood, earthquake, hurricane or volcano;
  4. you are called into active duty by the military to provide aid or relief as a result of a natural disaster;
  5. subpoena or being called to serve for jury duty.
  • Cancellation Penalty Waiver refunds are also provided if you are charged a change in occupancy/single supplement charge as a result of your traveling companion’s cancellation due to one of the reasons cited above. Please advise your travel agent, Royal Caribbean International or the Program Administrator as soon as possible in the event of cancellation. Refunds will not be provided for additional charges incurred that would not have been charged had you notified these parties as soon as reasonably possible.
  • *Please note the following restrictions: Royal Caribbean International will not waive their cancellation penalty and provide a cash refund, should you cancel your cruise vacation for any of the following reasons:
  1. a condition that first presents, worsens, becomes acute or has symptoms causing a person to seek diagnosis, care or treatment, or prompts a change in medication, during the 60 days before you purchased this waiver;
  2. mental, nervous or psychological disorders, or normal pregnancy, unless hospitalized; elective abortion; drugs or intoxicants, unless prescribed by a Physician; 
  3. business, contractual or educational obligations of you, an immediate family member, or traveling companion;
  4. declared or undeclared war, or any act of war;
  5. service in the armed forces of any country;
  6. any unlawful acts, committed by you or a traveling companion;
  7. other condition, event or circumstance occurring prior to your purchase of the Travel Protection Program.

 

The second form of cancellation coverage is more of a CFAR and includes 75% FCC or "Any Reason" cruise credits.  There is no 2 day notice prior to sailing requirement in Colorado.

  • “Any Reason” Cruise Credits…............................equal to 75% of the non-refundable pre-paid Cruise Vacation Cost In the event that you choose to cancel for a reason not authorized above or for a reason that is otherwise restricted, at any time up until departure, and you have purchased the Royal Caribbean Travel Protection Program, Royal Caribbean International will provide you a cruise credit equal to 75% of the non-refundable value (excluding AIR2SEA) of your Cruise Vacation prepaid to Royal Caribbean International, for your use toward a future cruise. This additional enhancement is offered by Royal Caribbean International as a special service to guests that purchase this cruise ticket Cancellation Penalty Waiver Addendum. Certain restrictions on the use of these cruise credits (such as blackout periods) may apply. Credits are valid for one year from issue date, are not transferable, and have no cash value. To be eligible for credits, notification of cancellation must be given to Royal Caribbean International prior to the ship’s departure. Once you’ve cancelled with Royal Caribbean International, please contact the Royal Caribbean Travel Protection Program Help Line at 1-800-453-4022 or 1-516-342-7262 regarding cruise credits. AIR2SEA is not subject to this cruise credit feature.

 

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4 hours ago, karl_nj said:

The aggravating part is that twangster also seems like a person who reads the fine print, and is very careful with details, but he is still having issues with his claim.

Indeed.  We can all read terms and conditions and interpret them to conclude we are covered but then discover an insurance company has a different interpretation. 

Whose to say if any other insurance policy through a different company would have yielded a different outcome?   

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8 hours ago, twangster said:

Indeed.  We can all read terms and conditions and interpret them to conclude we are covered but then discover an insurance company has a different interpretation. 

Whose to say if any other insurance policy through a different company would have yielded a different outcome?   

Or as is more likely, would any insurance company just keep giving you the runaround long enough to hope that you just gave up and went away. 

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